How Much Diversity Do We Need Before We Have To Much?

[see the light]

If diversity means letting people from all walks of life come into the country is there anytime when there is too much diversity. This is a serious question that should be answered. Many people rightly feel that the Balkinization of the country has begun. All religions, nationalities, ethnic identities allowed to come in and do like they do from whence they came. Assimilation is not for many of them. Moslems won't let thr women have the personnal freedoms they should have when living here. Certain Asians keep thr workers in a modern day bondage in sweatshops. Certain Hispanic organizations want more Spanish written and spoken across all the states. Mexicans want a say in how Mexican Americans vote in our elections. Hispanic gangs and European gangs fron ern Europe vie for turf along with Asian and other gangs in America's cities and suburbs. When do we get our culture back or did we have any?

[Billybob]

How much diversity? What a silly questions. That ignores the basic fact that there are 7 or so billion INDIVIDUALS on the planet. Grouping them into ethnicities or physical traits is purely a human invention.

Once you get rid of the notion that people are anything but individuals, then all this silliness about which GROUP is the best, or which GROUP is right seems more and more like child's play.

So basically, I'm of the opinion that there's already 100% diversity, and all the various labeled groups are merely the remnants of our territorial ape ancestors. Hundreds of thousands of years ago, humans marked thr territory with excretions. Now we do it with labels and ink excretions on paper.
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[CUJO]

Quote:So basically, I'm of the opinion that there's already 100% diversity, and all the various labeled groups are merely the remnants of our territorial ape ancestors. Hundreds of thousands of years ago, humans marked thr territory with excretions. Now we do it with labels and ink excretions on paper.

But, some are more apelike than others, and now they mark thr territory with graffiti, drug dealing and violence. What a great bunch of individuals!

[Billybob]

Yeah, and why do you think they do that?
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[CUJO]

BECAUSE THEY ARE UNEDUCATED, UNCIVILIZED LOWLIFES-THATS WHY!

[Billybob]

That makes as much sense as saying "they do ti because they're evil".

I mean really, with all we know about psychology, and how a person's socio-economic status and upbringing contributes to thr reality tunnels and behavior, I'm sorry but it's just ignorant to say that. Ignorant and EXTREMELY subjective.
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[CUJO]

SOME PEOPLE JUST CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH! HOPE YOU GET SOME OF THESE GREAT PEOPLE FOR NGHBORS SOON!

[Billybob]

What's the truth?

And by the way, who are "these people"? How might I recognize them?
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[CUJO]

THESE PEOPLE ARE THE ONES YOU SEE HANGING OUT ON CORNERS WITH NOTHING TO DO BUT DEAL DRUGS AND BREAK THE LAW. THESE PEOPLE ARE THE ONES WHO REFUSE TO WORK OR SUPPORT THR CHILDREN. THESE PEOPLE ARE THE ONES WHO LIVE OFF THE HONEST TAXPAYERS. THESE PEOPLE ARE THE ONES WHO PREY ON THE WEAK.

HOW DO YOU RECOGNIZE THEM? LETS SEE---THEY WILL BE THE ONES WHO BURGLARIZE YOUR HOME WHEN YOURE AT WORK. THEY WILL BE THE ONES SUPPLYING THE NGHBORHOOD WITH DRUGS. THEY WILL BE THE ONES WHO LIVE LIKE ANIMALS, HAVE ABANDONED CARS IN THE YARD, GARBAGE ALL OVER, AND CHILDREN WHO ROAM THE STREETS AT NIGHT. THEY WILL BE THE ONES GETTING SOCIAL SERVICES AND NOT WORKING. THEY WILL BE THE ONES WHOSE CHILDREN JOIN GANGS AND TERRORIZE THE NGHBORHOOD. THEY WILL BE THE ONES WITH THE POLICE AT THR HOUSE 3 TIMES A WEEK FOR DISTURBANCES. THESE ARE THE LOWLIFES OF SOCIETY WITH NO REDEEMING CHARACTERISTICS WHO ARE SLOWING FORCING THE REST OF US TO LIVE IN GATED COMMUNITIES. THESE ARE THE ONES YOU THINK ARE PART OF THE HUMAN RACE. THEY ARE----IN SPECIES ONLY.

[Billybob]

How often do you personally see these people? I mean firsthand. I live in LA, and I can tell you that even in the worst areas, you don't see this paranoid situation you're describing.

What's happening in this country is people are all afraid of each other. We think if we don't buy alarm systems, live in all white nghborhoods, or have lots of money, some random thug is going to come by and kill us. Or WORSE, offer us DRUGS! Has your house EVER been broken into? How about your family or friends? Did you know that 99% of home break-ins are perpetrated by "friends" or family of the victim? But you're right, it's ALL welfare mothers and slackers and DRUG USERS! Very convenient, if you ask me. And I like how you lump cleanliness in with criminality. I'd bet (and please correct me if I'm wrong) that you live in a mostly white, upper-middle class or middle class nghborhood. Don't think because you're paranoid about "lowlifes" that it equates to them "forcing" you to live behind bars. You're locking yourself away from any real understanding of what's going on.

Look at how judgemental you are of "these people". You seem to be saying that they are what they are (evil, stupid, not quite human) because that's how they were born. Or if it IS thr fault, it's certainly THR fault, and no one else's. Feels good to judge people; especially with all the stress in your life. Makes you feel like it's worth it. Just like the poletariate from Orwell. A group you can look down upon, no matter how screwy your life gets. America has always had such an underclass, be it Indians, black people, Irish, Chinese, Japanese (during World War 2), or Mexican.

Don't underestimate the effect that poverty has on the situation you described. Most of these people are just not able to raise themselves above thr situation in life. Don't you see that we're all tied together in this, and that none of the problems you see with go away by thinking of these people the way you do? Maybe we should lock them ALL up, and thr families and friends? That way, we can make sure that the poor alcoholic's children don't grow up to be the same (which happens VERY frequently).

You're not dealing with the causes of this, you're just bitching about how you percve the result. Why don't we make sure that everybody has adequate food, education, and healthcare. Is it really better to claim anyone who doesn't get these doesn't deserve it?
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[CUJO]

I HAVE COME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT YOU ARE AN IDIOT, AND THATS ALL I GOT TO SAY BOUT THAT.

[Billybob]

Well, resort to name calling again.

What are the qualifications of an idiot? How do I posess these qualities?

And is it easier to simply label me "an idiot" rather than actually think about what I said, or take the time to see if I'm wrong?
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[seeker of truth]

Just because you write in CAPS doesn't make you right in any way. Why don't you try throwing more facts and less names in your statements and maybe you might have some credibility. You guys crack me up. So rabid on the boards, like you have a chance of convincing anyone here. This is entertainment as they say, nobody is coming here to be educated about your arguments. Responding to your quotes is amusement to us just to see how much we can piss you off because of the way you try to flood the boards. Your turn.....
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[spock]

apparently you are not seeking the truth. you only want to trivialize those who don't adhere to the same unrealistic notions of a utopian world where everyone is mr. rodgers. I agree that we should all live and let live but unfortunately that is not the reality of the times we live.
Also wanting W to abdicate from his responability to protect our country and the world will not solve anything. I also believe that the blood of our soldiors and the Iraqis bng shed now is on the hands of people like you and the press and the French for not supporting the efforts of the military. your disent only serves to strengthen the resolve of those who mean to do the world harm.
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[vistor]

I was in L.A. just two years ago and everynight I saw Helicopers with head light flying all over the place..

I also would hear gun shots.... on and off .. Whats really going on in L.A.


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[Billybob]

I LIVE in LA, and I can assure you, people's paranoid perceptions of crime here are WAY exaggerated. I'm not saying there isn't crime, but not the kind people imagine; black welfare recipients randomly attacking people.

You should read "The Culture of Fear: Why Americans Are Afraid of the Wrong Things" by Barry Glassner. It very accurately details how America is bng duped into bng afraid of the most trivial and insignificant things, while ignoring REAL threats (cancer caused by pollution, rampany unemployement, inadequate medical care, etc). In fact, you're about ten thousand times more likely to die of lung cancer than you are of a terrorist attack.


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[vistor]

What do you think are the Trivial & Insignificant fears that people have today?


I will admit I did feel fear when I heard the gun shots. Confused at seng so many Holicopers.


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[Billybob]

Well, let me refer you to the amazon.com review of Mr. Glassner's book

Editorial Reviews

Amazon.com
Americans are afraid of many things that shouldn't frighten them, writes Barry Glassner in this book devoted to exploding conventional wisdom. Thanks to opportunistic politicians, single-minded advocacy groups, and unscrupulous TV "newsmagazines," people must unlearn thr many misperceptions about the world around them. The youth homicide rate, for instance, has dropped by as much as 30 percent in recent years, says Glassner--and up to three times as many people are struck dead by lightening than die by violence in schools. "False and overdrawn fears only cause hardship," he writes. In fact, one study shows that daughters of women with br cancer are actually less likely to conduct self-examinations--probably because the campaign to increase awareness of the ailment also inadvertently hghtens fears.
Although some sections are stronger than others, The Culture of Fear's examination of many nonproblems--such as "road rage," "Internet addiction," and airline safety--is very good. Glassner also has a sharp eye for what causes unnecessary goose bumps: "The use of poignant anecdotes in place of scientific evidence, the christening of isolated incidents as trends, depictions of entire categories of people as innately dangerous," and unknown scholars who masquerade as "experts." Although Glassner rejects the notion that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself, he certainly shows we have much less to fear than we think. And isn't that sort of scary?
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[vistor]

I see you like to read alot!!

Mr. Glassner is of one cpinion.. and I would not totally agree with all of his opinions but would read with interest.. Life is to complex to go by ideals of one person..

As I read what you wrote above I was thinking of 9/11 again and remember how many people had the fear to fly. I felt the same way.. I believe it was the shock of having three planes crash with in a few hours.. Not knowing why the moment it happen..
As time when by the ease of that fear lifted but not 100% I still don't think the Airport are any more safe now then before.

I happen to have the TV on the day this happen and I did see the second plane go into the tower.. So it's something I witnessed . 1 hour and 45 minutes I felt Sick and true fear.
I think fear is real but working it out and dealing with it can ease some of those feeling...

Just one opinion of my own..

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[midgetbones]

"Why don't we make sure that everybody has adequate food, education, and healthcare"

Billybob,
How would you go about doing this?
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[Billybob]

Well,

many experts have claimed that to give the entire world clean drinking water would only cost 10 million dollars or so. Modern technology (no, I don't mean GM crops) can help every nation on the world produce it's OWN food, enough to feed all it's people, and the US is most certainly able to create a national health care system where nobody has to pay the outrageous fees that they're bng charged now (and no, you don't sacrifice quality). There are an infinite number of ways to do this.

But America is so paranoid and stupid (not to sound too harsh), that we spend ALL the money on corporate tax breaks, and a MONUMENTAL military budget that wouldn't do a damned thing to protect us from another terrorist attack (these are just a few of the ridiculous expenditures, of course). And don't forget how companies with political connections basically get to charge whatever they want for thr services ($500 hammer, etc.). Perhaps if instead of $500 billion for our military, we could spend $499 and make sure everyone can see a doctor when they need to? Those aren't exact figures, of course, but you get the point.

I almost get the feeling that the power elite of this country wouldn't WANT everybody to be able to live happily and healthily.
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[Sum]

I agree on your last statement...

Doctor & health and Drugs company lobby against the people.. only for thr own greed

We have warehouse's in the U.S. full of over produced food so that we can control price.. Why not give it away.
Remember one time they threw butter away because to much was made...it was a great butter fat year..
Wheat that had gone bad and they burned because they wanted to keep the price up... they could have been given to the poor and other nations.




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[Billybob]

Yeah, I think the point is that there are any number of ways to make the world a better place, if that were our goal.

It seems obvious to me though that it ISN'T our goal. America wants to maintain it's supremacy over the rest of the world, and WITHIN the US, the power-elite want to maintain thr control and authority over everyone else.
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[vistor]

Power, Greed, Money, and BIG Corp. What it's about and yes to control us..

So what do you think of your new Governor??
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[mcj]

After reading his posts it's no wonder why he comes across as anti-American. Globalization for the masses is not what it appears to be. Corporate greed is fueling this and also like China, capitalism mixed with socialism dictatorship. It's our trade deficit fueling the Red Chinese army. It's our new found Moslem immigrants fueling terrorists groups financially from America. It's hispanic drug lords fueling terrorists and left and right wing dictatorships abroad and gangs in the USA. European and Asian mobsters who do business in the USA in drug running, money laundering, prostitution, credit card fraud, copywrite rip offs, pirated movies and cds etc. Yes ain't diversity grand. Our creator did create humans equally. But humans did not create nations equally. So why do we have people who are Americans out to destroy what so many have given thr all for. To compare immigration today with what it was 50, 70, 100 years ago is ludicrous. It is not the same and never will be.
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[shortwave]

Here are a few of them:m-13,two spanish speaking cities-LA and Miami, a 37 year white mechanical engineer murdered in his driveway. Who can we thank for bng so blessed by all this diversity? You may want to send a thank you not to Peter "America would die without immigrants" King.....Because he votes year in and year out for open borders, Peter King king should be tried for treason and dealt with accordingly.
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[shortwave]

If this 37 year white mechanical engineer had survived the attack by salvadoran immigrants he may have lived along enough to recve another of the blessings of diversity: thrown out of work at forty and replaced by a 25 year old brahmin immigrant from India. Pete King looking out after Long Island...not More like he is looking out after India, Pakistan, China, Mexico......
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[Billybob]

How many white people murder other white people?

You're giving this example as if it stands for ALL immigrants, or points out a trend in general. It does not!

So because an immigrant killed an American citizen, diversity is a terrible idea? That's rather extreme.
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[been there]

Billybob
Unregistered User
(11/19/03 12:38 pm)
Reply Firsthand?

How often do you personally see these people? I mean firsthand. I live in LA, and I can tell you that even in the worst areas, you don't see this paranoid situation you're describing.

Billybob
You live here also and you can?t see what is happening here , WOW , diversity left a long time ago .Crime welfare poverty , gangs have replaced taxpaying jobs and citizens .What rock are hiding under ?????
www.latimes.com/news/loca...ec02.story




County's Poor Areas Tripled, Study Finds
Inner-city ring of poverty intensifies, but the problem also has spread to nghborhoods in the suburban areas.
By Monte Morin
Times Staff Writer

December 2, 2003

The number of poor nghborhoods in the Los Angeles region has more than tripled over the last 30 years, with poor and very poor nghborhoods becoming more geographically concentrated in suburban areas, according to a UCLA-Brookings Institution study released Monday.

The study, titled "The Trajectory of Poor Nghborhoods in Southern California, 1970-2000," reports that immigration and the region's economy are responsible for a steady increase in the area's poverty rate and a shift in the location of poor nghborhoods.

"In the past three decades, the Los Angeles region has witnessed a large-scale spatial reorganization of poverty," the report states. "Where once concentrated poverty was confined to nghborhoods in the inner city, it has since spread to the suburbs."

DIVERSITY DECLINING AMONG IMMIGRANTS
Mexico, Latin America Comprise Growing Share of Forgn-Born

WASHINGTON (September 5, 2003) -- During the 1990s, the nation's immigrant population grew 11.3 million, faster than at any time in our history. One country -- Mexico -- and one region -- Spanish-speaking Latin America -- have come to dominate U.S. immigration.

A new report from the Center for Immigration Studies examines the changing composition of immigrants nationally and in each state. The findings show that diversity among the forgn born declined significantly in the 1990s, both nationally and at the state level. The report also finds that immigrants from some countries became more spread out in the 1990s, while the distribution of others changed little.

The report, entitled "Where Immigrants Live: An Examination of State Residency by Country in 1990 and 2000," contains detailed findings at both the national level and in all 50 states. It is on line at www.cis.org/articles/2003/back1203.html

Among the report's findings:

* In 1990, immigrants from the top sending country ? Mexico ? accounted for 22 percent of the total forgn born. By 2000, Mexican immigrants accounted for 30 percent of the total. Mexico alone accounted for 43 percent of the growth in the immigrant population between 1990 and 2000.

* In 39 states, the share of the immigrant population accounted for by the top sending country increased. The decline in diversity was most dramatic in Arkansas, North Carolina, Georgia, Indiana, Tennessee, Utah, Nebraska, and Alabama.

* Even in some states that had little diversity in 1990, the situation become even more pronounced during the decade. In Arizona, for example, immigrants from Mexico grew from 55 percent to 67 percent of the forgn born and in Texas, Mexicans increased from 59 to 65 percent of the total.

"In one sense today's immigration is more diverse than ever because people now arrive from every corner of the world," said Steven A. Camarota, the Center's Director of Research and coauthor of the report. "However, in another, and perhaps more important, sense it is less diverse. Allowing in so many people from one country and region of the world may significantly slow the assimilation process by creating the critical mass necessary for linguistic, cultural, and residential isolation."

* Looking at diversity by region of the world also shows a decline in diversity. One region -- Spanish-speaking Latin America -- accounted for more than 60 percent of the growth in the immigrant population in the 1990s.

* Declining diversity was due to very uneven growth in the size of different immigrant groups. For example, the number immigrants from Spanish-speaking Latin America increased by 7 million and those from Asia rose by over 2 million. In contrast, the number from Europe increased by less than 700,000, and those from Sub-Saharan Africa increased by about 400,000.

* Immigrants from some countries became much more dispersed during the decade. For example, the concentration of immigrants from Mexico, the Dominican Republic, and El Salvador fell significantly during the decade.

* In contrast, immigrants from Cuba actually become more concentrated, while the concentration of immigrants from countries such as Iran, Colombia, Jamaica, and Haiti remained virtually unchanged in the 1990s.

DISCUSSION: This report uses the terms "immigrant" and "forgn born" synonymously. It should be remembered that in both the 1990 and 2000 censuses, roughly one-fifth of the immigrants are estimated to be illegal aliens, and among the Mexican-born population the proportion is about half. It is also important to note that this report does not directly address the costs or benefits created by declining immigrant diversity. Instead, we provide detailed statistics on the changing composition of the nation's immigrant population both at the national level and in all 50 states. It seems reasonable to assume that the changing nature of immigration must have some implications for the way immigrants integrate. The most serious potential problem with a larger and less-diverse immigrant population is that it may hinder the assimilation of immigrants. The English language and American culture are the means by which diverse groups communicate with each other and the larger society. But if one group dominates in an area, then this may reduce the need to Americanize.


How much more would you like to spend on supplying the illegals /legals in the world that want to come here ????


75 PERCENT OF U.S. BUDGET IS FOR 'WELFARE STATE'!

By: Gordon Bishop

etherzone.com/2003/bish112703.shtml

The United States started out as the "Freedom Nation" when it adopted the finest Constitutional Republic in the history of civilization.



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[mcj]

There have been many stories of late on criminals from all across the globe who have found an ideal place in the good old USA. With our laws and customs of allowing people here with open arms and money from the taxpayers and almost no way to get rid of immigrant criminals we have become a joke. It seems as long as people and businesses prosper we keep those borders open and people flowing. But at some point we will have an epic choice to make if we want our country to truly be free for it's legitimate citizens or free for those who want to do us harm.
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[shortwave]

If we had a policy of 0 immigration in place for the past 37 years, 9/11 would never had happened. There is no economic, environmental or cultural justification for importing so many muslims. Here is another way to think about it: If America had been largely labor self sufficient since 1965-the year the 1965 immigration reform act was passed compliments of the trust fund kid Teddy Kennedy-9/11 would never had hapened. How could it? 9/11 happened because men like my father, a navigator on a B-17 during WW2, who went on to obtain a mechanical enginering degree were thrown out of work in the early 1970's and late 1970's . Men like my father, thousands of them. were thrown out of work as engineers by greedy Republican CEO's who replaced them with immigrants from the middle . These middle ern engineers went on to buy politicians such as Peter King ,Carolynn Mcarthy and the Clinton crime family who made family reunification the centerpce of US immigration policy. Family reunification had the effect of creating a chain migration that pulled in mohammed ata and his merry band of mass murderers. Most of the 9/11 hijackers were legal immigrants to America. Some of them were here reproducing creating families.How many of you think its great that the muslim population will double in the US in twenty years? Would you like to have 200 thousand muslims in the US military? How about muslims stationed on a US nuclear attack submarine? Thank congressman Peter King for these many blessings. Peter King you are treasonous scumbag
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[Justice 777]

Boy was your post right on the mark. I can vouch for it personally. I have some nghbors who are exactly as you described. They ruin nghborhoods and degrade everything. I could handle some diversity but now it is out of control. , These days they are NOT assimilating, many come in here illegally, and we are bng overrun with other cultures while our own American Heritage is receding. It is sad and frustrating to see America bng diminished at warp speed. Soon we will have no heritage left because it is politically incorrect to practice our own culture and religions in our own country , while we cow tow to all the diverse cultures who are taking over here. This melting pot is about to boil over.

[seeker of truth]

Do we now need a national religion in addition to english as the national language. Shortwave only mentioned muslims and middle erners, please describe how they ruin nghborhoods and degrade everything since it was his post you were agreng with.
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[shortwave]

Your property taxes are tied to the market value of your home.Even though your income doesn't go up, your property taxes do. Allowing so many immigrants into the US allows them to compete in the Long Island housing market. So in effect, immigrants by driving up the market value of your home, can potentially drive you out of your home. This is theft of property. This doesn't even take into account the school taxes you have to pay to educate Sandeep's kids. Some people, maybe a lot of people, will go down fighting. People aren't going to sit passively while thr home is auctioned off to a wealthy Sihk immigrant. Use your imagination. It will probably take a terrible event to finally put an end to this criminal overtaxation.
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[IDIOT]

How long do you think all this will continute till something (including massive deportation, riots, attacks on suspected illegals, etc) happens?

[shortwave]

There is a lot of talk these days about the plague on the land called sprawl.The Environmentalist fantasy is both to stop sprawl and maintain -possibly increase- the number of immigrants entering America. If the native born white middle class could not flee Long Island, they would be forced to confront the issue of immigration. Sprwal is a safety valve. If laws were passed today that prevented the native born white middle class from fleng places such as Long Island, a policy of 0 immigraron into the US would be put into place in a few weeks.
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[Justice777]

Thank you for starting this thread. It is an important one. The Balkanization of America has indeed begun. I posted this article on another thread but it really applies here too. I am amazed that some others aren't yet aware of what is happening in there own country. Even having to press 1 for English and 2 for Spanish hasn't raised an eyebrow.?? So I do hope others will "see the light" soon too. This article may help in the process. It is a great read....Here goes...

The coming nightmare of Balkanization
This wasn't supposed to happen here
[Reprinted from Issues & Views November 17, 2003]

Professor and writer Victor Davis Hanson offers his knowledge and insights on the subject of Mexican immigration and its impact on our society. In October, he spoke to students and faculty of Hillsdale College. Following are excerpts from what he had to say.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------What we see going on with Mexican immigration today is a tragedy, and it is not simply a result of the federal government abdicating its responsibility to control our borders (although the federal government has certainly done precisely that). The citizens of my state of California and others are also complicit in this tragedy. For instance, millions of us who used to cut our own lawns and clean our own houses now consider such tasks beneath us, as if America's middle class has embraced as its birthright the culture and lsure once confined to an aristocratic elite. Suddenly our young people, our poor and our unskilled find jobs picking apples or laying tiles somehow demeaning. So-called dead-end jobs are no longer a rite of passage for our youth, but are deemed proper only for unskilled laborers from Mexico, whose toil, we are assured, keeps our produce, restaurants and hotels inexpensive.

Related to this trafficking in human capital, a serious social and moral dilemma looms a mere decade away, when the Baby Boomers of California finally--and nearly all at once--reach retirement. Influential, affluent, informed--and not shy about self-interested self-promotion--these retirees will demand that Social Security and state retirement programs remain funded at promised levels. But these benefits will remain possible only with a complacent majority population of younger Hispanic immigrants with larger families, working for wages that are less, on average, than what is bng paid out to these aging white retirees with no dependents.

Data alone cannot decide for us whether California is saved or ruined by illegal immigration. Liberal economists, for example, offer models that demonstrate that illegal immigrants bring in $25 billion to America in net revenue per annum. Other statisticians employ quite different models showing that these same immigrants cost the United States over $40 billion a year--indeed, that the average California household must contribute at l $1,200 each year to subsidize the deficit between what illegal immigrants cost in services and what they pay in taxes. Who can sort out all the wildcard effects of cash income, fraudulent Social Security numbers and politicized research?

Tragically, political correctness makes it nearly impossible to discuss illegal immigration in any kind of rational way without bng labeled racist or nativist. Indeed, even the legal term "illegal alien" is now politically incorrect, and is bng replaced by "undocumented worker." But most know that not all illegal immigrants are workers, and that the problem of illegal immigration involves more than a lack of proper documentation.

We are told that blanket amnesty and a grant of legal status will ensure assimilation and prosperity. But statistics suggest that after 20 years, even legal Mexican immigrants have double the welfare rates of American citizens. And in one study, students surveyed at 13 years of age and then again at 17 were 50 percent more likely at 17 to identify themselves as "Mexicans" as opposed to "Mexican-Americans"--this despite, or perhaps even because of, having spent four years in American high schools.

We now ponder honoring identification documents from Mexico (alone of forgn countries) as legal American identification, even as we read of endemic corruption among police and bureaucrats across the border. In response, aliens from myriad other countries now demand that thr own forgn IDs be honored, and the other 49 states of the Union are not so sure they should accept California driver's licenses, given how promiscuously they are granted, at intrastate security check points. Thousands of immigrants from the Punjab, Korea and the Philippines wait patiently for five years or more to become naturalized citizens in the proper and legal fashion, only to watch hundreds of thousands cross illegally from Mexico in the expectation of a periodic and privileged amnesty designed only for them.

Almost everything stern and uncompromising that for two centuries has helped other immigrants to the United States--entry under legal auspices, language immersion, autonomy from government assistance, rapid assumption of an American identity and eager acceptance of mainstream American culture--has ther been dismissed as pass???r carried on halfheartedly.

Most Californians of all backgrounds understand the growing social and cultural costs that flow from this situation. Yet the Orwellian alliance of many libertarian-leaning conservatives--who embrace the idea of a perpetual supply of hard-working, unskilled and inexpensive workers--with the race industry of the Left--which envisions an endless influx of unassimilated potential voters who can be appealed to on the basis of group rather than individual identity--tends to demonize any discussion of the issue. Opposition to massive illegal immigration is customarily and cleverly equated with disdain for immigration per se, hence characterized as un-American.

Meanwhile Mexico, a richly endowed but nearly failed state, continues to refuse to do the political, cultural and economic restructuring that is needed to turn itself around. Indeed, why should it bother making these reforms when it can export potential dissidents from its hinterland to the U.S., gaining in the process $12 billion in remittances from expatriates? (These remittances constitute the second largest source of forgn exchange to the Mexican economy.)

A full 50 percent of real wage labor losses was recently attributed by the Labor Department to the influx of cheap immigrant labor. While we continue to import this labor, millions of second-generation Hispanic and other legal laborers are making not much more than the minimum wage. Of course, few of the professors and politicians who support illegal immigration--whether for continuance of cheap labor or for the sake of the entitlement industries--live in California's new aparthd communities like Orange Cove, Mendota or Parlier, communities where Mexican immigrants make up the vast majority of the population and struggle with dismal schools, high crime, little revenue and other social problems akin to those in Mexico.

In a country where there may be anywhere from ght to fifteen million illegal immigrants, is there any hope for avoiding the nightmare of Balkanization? Perhaps. After all, we got into our present mess only during the last 30 years, and then only by doing almost everything wrong. Thus we need not do everything right, but simply return to what we used to do so well: insist that immigration be measured and legal, do more of our own unpleasant work, enforce all of our laws equally, emphasize assimilation and return to thinking and speaking of Americans as individuals rather than in terms of thr racial or group identities.


-- Victor Davis Hanson is Professor of Classics at California State University, Fresno. He has authored and co-authored many books, including Carnage and Culture: Landmark Battles in the Rise of Western Power and Mexifornia: A State of Becoming.

________
Live Sex Webshows (http://livesexwebshows.com/)

[shortwave]

If Americans bothered to turn off Mike and the mad dog(or is it mike and the jackass) and read and thought about the water situation in the US ,they wouldn't sleep at night. Racial balkanization and water shortages, its a bad mix. California, which is now basically an immigrant state is completely dependent on water bng piped in from the largely white western states. Very soon these largely white western states are going to turn the spigot off. This is the stuff of civil wars. Actually its a blueprint for a civil war. I hope worshipping Bernie Williams and the Yankees was worth it. If Americans fully understood the water situation in the US, they would not tolerate the importation of a single legal immigrant. The US does not need to import its engineers, computer programmers, construction workers and postal workers. The protection of America's natural resources requires America to be largely labor self sufficient. If America were to become largely labor self sufficient, wages for American workers would much higher. The September 11 Al Queda terrorist attack was a direct consequence of the low wage labor policy pursued by both the Republican and Democratic parties. The low wage labor policy of the Republican And Democratic parties required the importation of millions of Muslim Arab immigrants. If these Muslim Arabs had not been allowed to migrate to America, 9/11 would never have happened. It was the presence of millions of so called "good" immigrants from the middle , that made it possible for Mohammed Atta and his mery band of throat slitters to enter the United States.
________
Easy Vape Review (http://vaporizer.org/)

[shortwave]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


For Friday, December 26, 2003

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Archives:
Fri.12.26.2003
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Fri.12.5.2003
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Mon.12.1.2003
Hardin Did Us A Service

Dr. Garrett Hardin and his wife, Jane, have died. He was 88, and she was 81. Dr. Hardin was a scientist and scholar who did us the invaluable service of pointing out unpleasant truths most of us do not wish to think about. Denial is an all-too-human characteristic.

One of those unpleasant truths is that while Earth and its resources are finite, population is not, and overpopulation will eventually kill our planet. Dr. Hardin spent many witty and scholarly pages debunking all the excuses people use to avoid facing this problem. They range from fantasies about space colonies to superstitious faith in technology. But technology won't save us, and there is no chance at all of colonizing space, the nearest star bng 4 quadrillion miles away.

I accept the concepts of limits. That is, after all, one of the characteristics of a true conservative. But Hardin, with his scientific mind and rigorous logic, goes the next step. Population can only be controlled by coercion. He favored China's one-child-per-family rule even at the price of forced abortions and sterilization.

This is something I especially find unpleasant. It goes against my libertarian grain. It goes against my respect for life. Yet, what is China to do? With a population base of more than 1 billion people, even a small percentage increase adds tens of thousands of mouths to feed. Unchecked, population growth will be a disaster.

The good news, Hardin has written, is that the population of North America and Europe can be easily controlled ? if we slam the doors on immigration. The bad news is that there is not the political will to do it.

"Diversity within a nation destroys unity and leads to civil wars," Dr. Hardin wrote. "Immigration, a benefit during the youth of a nation, can act as a disease in its mature state. Too much internal diversity in large nations has led to violence and disintegration."

On another occasion, he wrote: "If two cultures compete for the same bit of turf and if one of the populations increases faster than the other, then year by year the population that is reproducing faster will increasingly outnumber the slower one ... in time the slowly reproducing population will be displaced by the fast one. This is passive genocide. It may be that no one is ever killed, but the genes of one group replace the genes of the other. That's genocide."

You can see what he is talking about in California, which one writer now calls Mexifornia. The corrupt and elitist government of Mexico has no intention of curbing population growth. It is actively shoveling its surplus people across the border into our country. We are, like the 19th-century American Indians, facing the start of a massive migration from hapless, poor nations into North America (and Europe).

Dr. Hardin often used the analogy of a lifeboat. Any lifeboat has a definite carrying capacity. Add more passengers, and it will sink and all will drown. Therefore, it becomes a hard question: Can those in the lifeboat condemn others to drown so that they might live? If they can't, everybody drowns. And that, friends ? denials notwithstanding ? is the situation we are facing.

I have often said that if you want to know what immigration can do to you, ask the few remaining American Indians. They were defeated to the point of virtual genocide not by arms but by mere numbers of European immigrants. Our ancestors did not outfight them. We outbred them.

No question facing America today is more important than shutting down runaway immigration, both legal and illegal, and yet not one stinking politician running for president has the guts to even mention it. Our ancestors did hard things to leave us a country worth living in. Now it's our turn. ther we make the hard choices or we leave our posterity a mongrelized, impoverished cesspool for a country.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
? 2003 by King Features Syndicate, Inc.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


________
Toyota carina ii history (http://www.toyota-wiki.com/wiki/Toyota_Carina_II)

[mcj]

All around the country we have schools and government offices that can't display a Christmas tree or have an Menorah on view. Then why is it that Moslems can wear head scarfs and that is permissible?
________
Wendie 99 (http://www.lovelywendie99.com/)

[Justice777]

Shortwave....wow that was an ominous and truthful post you just made. 9/11 was most definitely related to our "open door" policy for immigrants...legal and illegal, and those who overstay thr visas, so called "student visas" etc.The subject of water and natural recources is also a hot one. Yes, you are right. This is what cival wars are made of. "A blueprint for cival war" as you put it. So true. And very scary. I pray that everyone will "wake up" before it's too late.
MCJ, you are absolutely right about the intolerance for Christian icons, and over tolerance for Muslim, athiest, etc beliefs.(or non beliefs) are bng displayed in our govt. offices, public schools, etc. lately. Heck, the Jewish children aren't even allowed to wear a Yamaka to school but the muslim head dress is tolerated without so much as a whisper. Interesting, don't you think. ? Yes there most certainly IS a double standard going on here. Is our country becoming ....anti Christian??? I am starting to wonder.

________
Paxil Side Effect (http://www.classactionsettlements.org/lawsuit/paxil/)

[shortwave]

A year ago, Osama Bin Ladens second in command was captured in Pakistan. Turns out that this guy studied engineering at an American university. This is unbelievable. I have know idea if this guy actually worked as an engineer in America. If he wanted to, he could have. It certainly wouldn't have bothered congressman Peter King. Isn't this outrageous. This guy was given an opportunity to rob an American engineer of his or her job. Moral of the story:America should have been labor self sufficient like it was in the past. If America had been labor self sufficient for the past forty years, 9/11 would never have happened. Here is what I'm getting at: it was the low wage labor policy of both the Republicans and Democrats that made 9/11 possible. If we had a national origins immigration policy that prevented muslims from immgrating to America, 9/11 would never have happened. Why is Peter King allowed to get away with this?Check out his voting record on immigration over at numbersusa.com
________
MAZDA B-SERIES (INTERNATIONAL) (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Mazda_B-Series_(International))

[AntiRacist]

OK, so let me gbet ths straight. THe country where our ansestors came to find freedom from religious persecusion should now start preventing Muslims from entering simply becasue of thr religion? That is the most asinine thign I've heard on this board in a while! So then, by that same token, would we also prohibit Catholic, Jewish, Hindu, Buddihist and anything other then Protestant immigrants into the country because they pose a threat to the WASP majority since thr simply not the same? I suppose you also think WASP's were always here and that the dicovery of America by COlumbus is a myth...

As far as job stealing imigrants. If an immigrants gets the job and not you, tough @#%$. If they're legal and educated then they have a littel thing called the Equal Opportunities Act on thr side. It keeps idiots like you from holding Human Resources positions and discriminating against workers because you don't like thier nation of origin.

PS--9/11 would have been prevented if we weren't a world dominating, cultural impearialist, unilateral nation invading superpower that does whatever it wants. People didn't just bomb us for fun, we are international agressors who love to pass the blame. Deal with it.

[English Major]

gbet
ansestors
persecusion
becasue
thign
Buddihist
dicovery
imigrants
littel
impearialist

[shortwave]

Antiracist, you haven't given me any reason to support open borders immigration. So I will continue to oppose open borders immigration. Why should I, a man of European descent, support high levels of immigration into America? The vast majority of Americans of European descent are opposed to an open borders immigration policy. The open borders immigration policy that you are so enamoured of, has at its core,an intense hatred of Americans of European descent.By the way, your treason will be punished one day.
________
Mercedes-benz 190 history (http://www.mercedes-wiki.com/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_190)

[shortwave]

December 30, 2003



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A dissenting student hounded for his views


By Valerie Richardson
THE WASHINGTON TIMES



Tim Bueler recently recved some unusual advice: His principal and a campus police officer suggested that he stay home from his California high school for a few days.
They feared for his safety because Tim, the founder of Rancho Cotate High School's new Conservative Club, said he had recved threats from other students after writing an article for the club newsletter calling for a crackdown on illegal immigration.
The 17-year-old junior says that stance inspired threats from which teachers have refused to protect him. Some faculty members even started a public campaign against his group, which seeks to promote "the pillars of the Bible, patriotism and conservative beliefs as balance to the mostly liberal viewpoints of teachers," according to its newsletter, "The Conservative Agenda."
In a telephone interview, Tim said he's been threatened at l three times by Hispanic students who call him "white boy" and "racist." One boy said he was going to "find someone" to beat up Tim.
In two of those instances, Tim said two faculty members stood by and did nothing to help him. Most recently, Tim said, he was confronted by a dozen Hispanic boys, who blocked him from walking down the hallway.
"They said, 'You're a racist,' and I said, 'Are you guys going to let me through?' " Tim said. "So I ducked into a classroom and told the teacher what was happening, and said, 'Can you help me?' And she said, 'No. Get out of here.' "
Earlier, he said he was eating lunch in a classroom when about seven Hispanic students surrounded him. Worried for Tim's safety, his father, Dennis Bueler, said he asked for help from a teacher who was also in the room.
"The teacher told him, 'When you say things like that, you've got to expect that things like this are going to happen. Why don't you go out the back door?' " Mr. Bueler said in recounting the incident.
Tim said teachers have also joined in the name-calling. One called Tim a Nazi, while another described the club as "a bunch of bigots." In a parody of the newsletter, biology teacher Mark Alton called on students to "take a stand against the neoconservative wing-nuts who call themselves Americans."
Tim thought about leaving the school, located in Rohnert Park about an hour north of San Francisco, and then made his decision: No way.
"They said, 'It's in your best interest not to go to school,' " Tim said. "I said, 'Well, why? What have I done wrong?' "
The club has invited students to call its "liberal assault hot line" to report whether they've been "verbally assaulted for bng conservative."
With about 50 members, the club has hosted speakers from the Eagle Forum and National Rifle Association.
Forty school staff members signed a letter to the Santa Rosa Press Democrat calling on the Conservative Club to back up its accusations that students are bng indoctrinated.
"They've made all these sweeping statements about liberal teachers warping the curriculum, but as a science teacher, I'd like to see some evidence," said Mr. Alton, who co-authored the letter.
Mr. Alton said he was also disturbed by Tim's article on illegal immigration, which says, "Liberals welcome every Muhammad, Jamul and Jose who wishes to leave his Third World state and come to America."
"No one at the high school opposes the formation of the Conservative Club," Mr. Alton said. "What bothers me is the extreme views that border on racism or homophobia, the negative tone, and the hot line that calls teachers 'traitors.' "
Tim admitted that his zeal sometimes gets the best of him. He apologized for the "Muhammad" remark, saying, "I made a mistake, but I'm not racist." Club adviser Bernadette Tucker stepped down after Tim printed the newsletter without allowing her to edit it first.
Rancho Cotate Principal Mitchell Carter and district officials did not return several phone calls.
Mr. Bueler said he's ready to bring in lawyers if the school cannot protect his son. "The police don't think they were real threats, but I disagree. He shouldn't have to be threatened every day," the father said.




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December 30, 2003



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Rumbling on the hard-line right

Democrats slam Dean over secrecy

Where punishment must fit the faith

Air marshals ordered on U.S.-bound flights

A dissenting student hounded for his views

Nasdaq index pushes past 2,000 barrier







Workers in Iran Shift Focus to Injured

Philippines to Deport Two U.S. Brothers

Nuclear Agency Rejects U.S. Help in Libya

Second Package Bomb Intercepted in Hague

Bomb Blast Kills One in Area Near Baghdad

AP: Ex-Khmer Rouge Leader Admits Genocide

Pakistan's Senate Approves Musharraf Deal

Diplomat: Militants Eyng Saudi Officials

Israel's Settler Population Sees Growth

U.S. Kills 10, Arrests 100 in Afghanistan




Gift card buyers better watch fees

China-EU launch space project

EU pins hopes on Serbia reformers

Letter bombs sent to EU officials

Japan pledges debt reduction for Iraq

UPI NewsTrack TopNews

Freed hostages never knew kidnappers

Inspector: Libya not close to making nukes








A dissenting student hounded for his views


By Valerie Richardson
THE WASHINGTON TIMES



Tim Bueler recently recved some unusual advice: His principal and a campus police officer suggested that he stay home from his California high school for a few days.
They feared for his safety because Tim, the founder of Rancho Cotate High School's new Conservative Club, said he had recved threats from other students after writing an article for the club newsletter calling for a crackdown on illegal immigration.
The 17-year-old junior says that stance inspired threats from which teachers have refused to protect him. Some faculty members even started a public campaign against his group, which seeks to promote "the pillars of the Bible, patriotism and conservative beliefs as balance to the mostly liberal viewpoints of teachers," according to its newsletter, "The Conservative Agenda."
In a telephone interview, Tim said he's been threatened at l three times by Hispanic students who call him "white boy" and "racist." One boy said he was going to "find someone" to beat up Tim.
In two of those instances, Tim said two faculty members stood by and did nothing to help him. Most recently, Tim said, he was confronted by a dozen Hispanic boys, who blocked him from walking down the hallway.
"They said, 'You're a racist,' and I said, 'Are you guys going to let me through?' " Tim said. "So I ducked into a classroom and told the teacher what was happening, and said, 'Can you help me?' And she said, 'No. Get out of here.' "
Earlier, he said he was eating lunch in a classroom when about seven Hispanic students surrounded him. Worried for Tim's safety, his father, Dennis Bueler, said he asked for help from a teacher who was also in the room.
"The teacher told him, 'When you say things like that, you've got to expect that things like this are going to happen. Why don't you go out the back door?' " Mr. Bueler said in recounting the incident.
Tim said teachers have also joined in the name-calling. One called Tim a Nazi, while another described the club as "a bunch of bigots." In a parody of the newsletter, biology teacher Mark Alton called on students to "take a stand against the neoconservative wing-nuts who call themselves Americans."
Tim thought about leaving the school, located in Rohnert Park about an hour north of San Francisco, and then made his decision: No way.
"They said, 'It's in your best interest not to go to school,' " Tim said. "I said, 'Well, why? What have I done wrong?' "
The club has invited students to call its "liberal assault hot line" to report whether they've been "verbally assaulted for bng conservative."
With about 50 members, the club has hosted speakers from the Eagle Forum and National Rifle Association.
Forty school staff members signed a letter to the Santa Rosa Press Democrat calling on the Conservative Club to back up its accusations that students are bng indoctrinated.
"They've made all these sweeping statements about liberal teachers warping the curriculum, but as a science teacher, I'd like to see some evidence," said Mr. Alton, who co-authored the letter.
Mr. Alton said he was also disturbed by Tim's article on illegal immigration, which says, "Liberals welcome every Muhammad, Jamul and Jose who wishes to leave his Third World state and come to America."
"No one at the high school opposes the formation of the Conservative Club," Mr. Alton said. "What bothers me is the extreme views that border on racism or homophobia, the negative tone, and the hot line that calls teachers 'traitors.' "
Tim admitted that his zeal sometimes gets the best of him. He apologized for the "Muhammad" remark, saying, "I made a mistake, but I'm not racist." Club adviser Bernadette Tucker stepped down after Tim printed the newsletter without allowing her to edit it first.
Rancho Cotate Principal Mitchell Carter and district officials did not return several phone calls.
Mr. Bueler said he's ready to bring in lawyers if the school cannot protect his son. "The police don't think they were real threats, but I disagree. He shouldn't have to be threatened every day," the father said.




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[AntiRacist]

Debate at the Ranch mirrors U.S.

December 26, 2003


By CHRIS COURSEY
THE PRESS DEMOCRAT



To examine the state of American political discourse these days, don't look to Washington or Sacramento or Iowa or New Hampshire.


Cast your gaze on Rancho Cotate High School in Rohnert Park.


There we have a microcosm of our nation's political relations. At the Ranch, as in the rest of America, argument takes the place of debate and slogans have replaced ideas.


And they say young people don't pay attention to adults any more.


It would be easy to blame all of this on the school's newly minted Conservative Club, which organized to combat students bng "brainwashed by the liberal bias of teachers," according to one member.


It probably didn't help that the club adopted the provocative motto, "Protecting our borders, language and culture," or that one of its first speakers was a National Rifle Association member who lectured on why "We Need More Guns in Schools."


And you know it's a bad sign when the club's president, 17-year-old junior Tim Bueler, lists loudmouth radio talk show host Michael Savage as one of his conservative heroes, and then cops some of Savage's pugnacious attitude in his dealings with teachers and fellow students.


But, as is the case with politics around the nation, it took two sides to create a poisonous political atmosphere at the school.


Other students have threatened Bueler, he says. Teachers have compared his criticism to "McCarthyism." After the club passed out fliers urging students to report "un-American comments" by teachers labeled "liberal traitors," one teacher responded with a parody flier citing "reactionary students" and "neo-conservative wing-nuts."


Ah, the hallowed halls of academia.


What's so disturbing about all of this is that it's not an isolated dust-up at a suburban high school. It's what passes for political thought in America today.


He who shouts loudest wins. A punchy put-down is better than persuasion. Stake out the extreme edges because the middle ground is for wimps. And always remember that anyone with a different opinion is an idiot, or worse.


Sure, it's tough to get elected with that philosophy. But who cares about getting elected? If you want to be heard (i.e., Savage or Michael Moore) or you want to make a pile of dough (i.e., Rush Limbaugh or Al Franken), ignore all shades of gray and paint everything in black and white.


The president is evil; his opponents are traitors. 'Nuff said.


Clearly, given the Arbitron ratings and the best-seller lists, the public finds all of this entertaining. But where is it taking us?

Politics is the art of compromise. It's a process that is supposed to help us find the best solutions for the greatest number of people. At one time it was -- and it still can be -- an arena where people can disagree without hating each other, where a different opinion does not identify its holder as a bad person.


I talked to Bueler on the phone the other day. He opened the conversation with a challenge, denounced liberalism as a "mental disease," called the ACLU and other groups "dangerous." He came across as an angry young man with a chip on his shoulder.


But we kept talking. And behind the labels and slogans he revealed a thoughtful, intelligent kid who seems to genuinely care about his school, his country, his generation.


He'd have a much better chance of getting that across if he would tone down his rhetoric.


But how's he supposed to know that? Who is providing the role model for the Tim Buelers of the world to follow?

You can reach Chris Coursey at 521-5223 or ccoursey@pressdemocrat.com.

[middleclass]

If anti-racism is a concerned person with a compassionate view of things then he /she should also be against people or organizations that use the term racist when it shouldn't be applied. A perfect example of this is the newspaper Newsday using that term to denigrate the people of Farmingville who just wanted to have a serious quality of life issue remedied. These people were not racists but concerned people who watched thr nghborhood be flooded with illegal aliens who had some unruly habits. In some cases even criminal in nature. This activity is occurring in other towns on Long Island also.The underground economy flourishes because of illegal aliens but people like me the middleclass gets screwed by people who pay no taxes and others who pay very few. The real estate slumlord makes millions from rents and from what I hear also from our tax dollars in the form of HUD money. Immigration in general to suburbia has created the biggest spike in housing costs ever and created a shortage of affordable housing. This all to the glee of real estate interests evrywhere. Where is the compassion for legal indigent people who can't find affordable housing and must compete with forgners for that housing? Bad enough the open border policy has hurt low scaled salaried workers the most. Many of them are long time citizens of minority populations including Hispanic. Perhaps this can some it up the best: A person with very liberal views on immigration and housing is associated with a Long Island school district. She wants all children of illegal aliens educated. She wants affordable housing for them. She wants thr medical needs taken care of. And as is many of these situations she lives in an exclusive part of town where housing is measured by acres and downzoning is not allowed. Her family owns over twenty fast food stores which relies heavily on immigrants working there. Enough said it's time to lower immigration rates and properly screen immigrants before arrival. Illegal aliens from all countries should be properly and quickly deported. In an age when Islamic fascists want to destroy our civilization and have succeeded already in destroying our largest largest skyscraper, (other buildings and airliners plus thousands of people) anything less is plain treason.
________
MINI (BMW) HISTORY (http://www.bmw-tech.org/wiki/Mini_(BMW))

[AntiRacist]

While I am concerned with racism and I take note when the term is used out of bounds, Newsday had a point. I've heard Sachem Quality of Life rhetoric and despite how they put a happy face on the "deport illegal aliens" speak, if you are to encounter a member individually you will see the underlying racist tone of things. It's been seen, experienced, understood and documented.
Sure there are members who are there for none other than legitimate concern over health, wages lost and crime issues, but for each compassionate diversity loving member you have then a fanatical member who wants to "send them all home."
And that there is my beef with shortwave who takes it a step further. 'Send everyone home, even legal immigrants. America belongs to those who are already here,' he says. 'Immigrants took my job, so I hate everyone now. Pity me, I can't deal with a changing world since now I'm middle-aged and too old to change careers.'
Every god damned generation of this country felt the same way throughout the history of this country, ignoring the fact that thr ancestors were immigrants themselves that withstood the same criticisms and hardships. The rhetoric mirrors the KKK who think that White Europeans Anglo Saxton Protestants are the only ones the Constitution applies to.
Calling people who love what our statue of liberty stands for "traitors" and adding that I'll be tried for my "crimes" is the most laughable thing I've ever heard on this board. Free speach is a crime, huh? Utter hyposcrasy by saying a nation founded by immigrants, in a state known as "the gateway to freedom, (ny)" should not let another living soul immigrate here should be the real crime. The crime of bng an "mental midgit" as shortwave would put it. But alas, free speach protects the ignorant as well or the KKK would have been hung long ago.
And by the way...looking into The Eagle Forum, the organization the controversial California HS Conservative CLub had a guest speaker from proved interesting.THere are free class lessons on the website promoting the Creationist Theory of evolution, as in Adam and Eve should be taught in biology class.Talk about a political agenda in the classroom...

[shortwave]

Antiracist, just admit it, you hate Americans of European descent. The American left hates Americans of European descent. The American left is very open about it. Hatred of Americans of European descent is at the core of the American left's open borders immigration policy. Antiracist, one day, you and the rest of the American left will be held accountable for treason. Since you haven't given me any reason to be in favor of high levels of immigration, I will continue to oppose high levels of immigration.
________
Vaporite solo (http://www.vaporshop.com/solo-vaporizer.html)

[shortwave]

American left's true agenda.:the demographic annihilation of White America.
________
HERBALAIRE VAPORIZERS (http://vaporizers.net/herbalaire-vaporizer)

[shortwave]

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For Friday, December 26, 2003

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Hardin Did Us A Service

Dr. Garrett Hardin and his wife, Jane, have died. He was 88, and she was 81. Dr. Hardin was a scientist and scholar who did us the invaluable service of pointing out unpleasant truths most of us do not wish to think about. Denial is an all-too-human characteristic.

One of those unpleasant truths is that while Earth and its resources are finite, population is not, and overpopulation will eventually kill our planet. Dr. Hardin spent many witty and scholarly pages debunking all the excuses people use to avoid facing this problem. They range from fantasies about space colonies to superstitious faith in technology. But technology won't save us, and there is no chance at all of colonizing space, the nearest star bng 4 quadrillion miles away.

I accept the concepts of limits. That is, after all, one of the characteristics of a true conservative. But Hardin, with his scientific mind and rigorous logic, goes the next step. Population can only be controlled by coercion. He favored China's one-child-per-family rule even at the price of forced abortions and sterilization.

This is something I especially find unpleasant. It goes against my libertarian grain. It goes against my respect for life. Yet, what is China to do? With a population base of more than 1 billion people, even a small percentage increase adds tens of thousands of mouths to feed. Unchecked, population growth will be a disaster.

The good news, Hardin has written, is that the population of North America and Europe can be easily controlled ? if we slam the doors on immigration. The bad news is that there is not the political will to do it.

"Diversity within a nation destroys unity and leads to civil wars," Dr. Hardin wrote. "Immigration, a benefit during the youth of a nation, can act as a disease in its mature state. Too much internal diversity in large nations has led to violence and disintegration."

On another occasion, he wrote: "If two cultures compete for the same bit of turf and if one of the populations increases faster than the other, then year by year the population that is reproducing faster will increasingly outnumber the slower one ... in time the slowly reproducing population will be displaced by the fast one. This is passive genocide. It may be that no one is ever killed, but the genes of one group replace the genes of the other. That's genocide."

You can see what he is talking about in California, which one writer now calls Mexifornia. The corrupt and elitist government of Mexico has no intention of curbing population growth. It is actively shoveling its surplus people across the border into our country. We are, like the 19th-century American Indians, facing the start of a massive migration from hapless, poor nations into North America (and Europe).

Dr. Hardin often used the analogy of a lifeboat. Any lifeboat has a definite carrying capacity. Add more passengers, and it will sink and all will drown. Therefore, it becomes a hard question: Can those in the lifeboat condemn others to drown so that they might live? If they can't, everybody drowns. And that, friends ? denials notwithstanding ? is the situation we are facing.

I have often said that if you want to know what immigration can do to you, ask the few remaining American Indians. They were defeated to the point of virtual genocide not by arms but by mere numbers of European immigrants. Our ancestors did not outfight them. We outbred them.

No question facing America today is more important than shutting down runaway immigration, both legal and illegal, and yet not one stinking politician running for president has the guts to even mention it. Our ancestors did hard things to leave us a country worth living in. Now it's our turn. ther we make the hard choices or we leave our posterity a mongrelized, impoverished cesspool for a country.


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? 2003 by King Features Syndicate, Inc.
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________
VALIUM REHAB ADVICE (http://www.rehab-forum.com/valium-rehab/)

[AntiRacist]

Are you planning a second time at trying to set up that LI KKK sect? White America I hate? European decentants I hate? No sir, it is just your ignorance and the fact that segregationalists like you still exist my world that I hate.
I may be liberal, but I am not a self-hating white boy. My family is from Western Europe. I love my heritage and have visited a few of the nations my family came from. I also love my country, my home, my LI...
Just because I believe in immigrants rights doesnt make me a traitor. If anything, you are a traitor to the ideals that this nation has stood for since its birth: that you can find a better life here if you you feel like leaving your home country.
The American left willl not, as your delusions lead you to belve, be tried for treason. You will just be forced to take you medication.
"demographic anihilation of white America." That's very poetic. Perhaps you plagerized from your racist frnds?
Here's similar rhetoric from a "grass roots" organization (Professional Racists): "If those who hate the white race continue to push us towards extinction by overrunning our homelands with non-white immigrants and if they proceed with thr plans to dilute our genes in miscegenational suicide, they will find the abyss will be upon them!

We do not wish to harm anyone. We want a peaceful solution to this problem. Right now, all we have to do is establish laws that will protect the sanctity of our white homelands and the perpetuation of our white race. No other action is required. All races deserve thr own countries and we support a black Africa, a yellow Asia, a brown South America and a white Europe, Australia, and North America. Each race has its own land and its own people and that is how it should be.

If you agree with this simple common sense ideal, then join with us and support the White America campaign."

Maybe you'll feel right at home at thr website, shortwave? www.whitefuture.com/html/wa.html

[shortwave]

Antiracist, if environmentalist were able to stop sprawl- lets say next week some time- how much longer do you think current US immigration would last? I put this question to everyone out there who reads Nasau County Politics. Well I think the answer is obvious. Immigration would be brought down to 0 in a couple of days. Tell me what you think Mr. Antiracists. By the way here are my favorite websites: z magazine;counterpunch;the nation;antiwar.com and Noel Ignatievs kill whitey website. Oh I forgot to mention vdae.com and americanpatrol.com. Also, what did you think of the comments made by a multimillionaire fat bastard legal immigrant from India on the Lou Dobbs show one month ago. This little fat bastard of a legal immigrant from India said that there will be very serious consequences for the US if the H1B visa program is terminated. The facist prime minister of India Vaypayeee made a similar comment two days ago. Do you like this kind of stuff?
________
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[shortwave]

The aforementioned little fat bastard from India died a day after his appearance on Lou Dobbs. Good riddance!!!
________
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[shortwave]

I have also read every book and paper written by Noam Chomsky.
________
WEED VAPORIZER (http://weedvaporizers.org/)

[Sum]

Your full of Bull You have never met up with the real SQL people I am one of the first people who help start SQL.. I'm a home owner that cares about my Town..

I am no racist but know you only read what Newsday prints...

I care for all people but I also care about my Community.. I have a heart of Gold and would stop to help anyone... in fact I did help an Illegal Immigrant when he double over in pain and his Illegal boss was trying to push him off ... I got him to the Hospital .. That more then most would do... He had Kidney stones and needed help..

I have been to Wash.DC to to fight for my Community and have been to many meeting with INS.. I have worked with the leadership that is local to make my Community a better place..

I sick of your kind making remarks that are coming from the Media when you know nothing of the truth..




________
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[shortwave]

Here is all you need to know about Newsday. Newsday lives off of adverstiser money.Who advertises in Newsday? Big businesses and medium size businesses. And what do they want? Wage Slaves. If you whore for the business communty who can get yourself a nice home in Llyod Neck like the publisher of Newsday( the white house with the big old tree in front, large branch held up by metal bar). Scumbags such as Bart Jones will be held accountable onre day for thr treason against America.
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MAZDA 787B SPECIFICATIONS (http://www.ford-wiki.com/wiki/Mazda_787B)

[Justice777]

The blessings of diversity have long since passed since we have implemented this open border policy. Alot of the ills that result from illegals has been mentioned. I am surprised that many Americans are in such a state of denial about this. Just look at the banks, govt offices etc that has everyone in America having to press one for English and 2 for Spanish. Shouldn't that be an unmistakable clue that immigration is out of control and people are NOT assimilated into the melting pot of America. How about riding in your car past hoards of illegal day laborers waiting to be picked up on street corners? How about the many nghborhoods which are bng trashed by too many illegal families living under one roof which is supposed to be a one family house. How about Bi-lingual Kindergarten and classes which are now bng added to our schools and bumping up school taxes. How about the taxes in general going up partially due to all the free services that the illegals are recving. I mean, come on. Isn't anyone getting fed up with this disgrace and abuse to our system????
I think we should all just go down to Mexico, and work off the books jobs, send the wages back to our Friends and family still left here on the Long Island, recve free social services from THR country, and refuse to blend into thr culture and refuse to speak Spanish. I wonder if THEY would implement pressing 1 for Spanish and 2 for English to cater to US in THR country???????Maybe getting a dose of thr OWN medicine might be just what the Doctor ordered.!
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[antianti racists]

But countries are different as are cultures. The word racism was used by Huntington Democrats to hurt the political fortunes of a local Republican who has railed about the lack of enforcing housing and building codes. Because of this illegal housing has multiplied drastically in the town these past ten years. Many who live in these houses are crammed in to very tight spaces. Until thr is a fire or some other catastrophe town ignores most of this. The courts only slap a small fine on slumlords who do get to go. This Republican activist wants to see these slumlords and anybody who rents to have thr premises inspected for the health and safety of thr tenants and surrounding community. But alas the Democrats don't want these homes inspected and are on the side of the landlord and homeowner association which is made up of slumlords.
Anti-racist is misguided in comparing immigration today of immigration a century ago. Land is not in abundant supply and nther are our tax dollars to support all this immigration. Blacks and Latinos and Asians who have lived in Huntington for a generation or more also feel that immigration that is not lowered and controlled will hurt thr American dream. Anti racist should realize that what is going on with our immigration policies is also hurting America's minority population too.

[AntiRacist]

One: I didn't compare immigration of century ago to today, I said we should not leave behind the fundamental tradition of allowing immigration into the US. I'm not misguided, you just misread or misinterpreted.
Two: as an antianti racist doesn't that make you a racist as the name is a double negative?
Three: Rich McGrath, uhg... As much as you'd like to belve it was just Huntington Dems that called hima racist, it was the whole island. Newsday (I know, the leftist conspiritors, but hear it out) ran a special anti-endorsement of the guy. No matter what political affiliation of the paper is, to run an anti-endorsement is a pretty powerful statement...especially for a paper that recently took the stance of not endorsing anybody in races it felt were a mere selection of the less evil candidate. The anti-endorsement came at about the same time that Rich McGrath weas trying to capitalize off of a house fire and goes as follows:

HEADLINE: Hypocrisy in Huntington Council Race

BODY:
Don't be fooled by the glibness and charm of the salesman, or by his ability to think on his feet. Take a deep whiff of what Richard McGrath is selling, and it comes up smelling too much like racism and hypocrisy.

McGrath, a Huntington school board member, is running for Huntington town council with this mantra: "We want a quality town, not an overdeveloped city." That is classic racist code: "Town" equals "us" and "city" equals "them." And we all know who "they" are.

In his latest campaign mailing, addressed to Democratic incumbents Susan Berland and Marlene Budd, McGrath says: "You've done enough harm to Huntington Station." The mailing offers a collage of headlines, including drug arrests, shooting incidents and fires. The nauseating subliminal message is clear: Only McGrath will keep you safe from "them."

The town is working to revitalize Huntington Station and develop housing for working families. McGrath is working to block that, and he has drawn large, cheering crowds.

One plan is to encourage apartments above stores. That seemed like a good idea to McGrath when he was getting started in life and lived over a store in Huntington. Now he blasts this sensible approach as a bad idea. Though McGrath does not seem to understand why, that is breathtakingly hypocritical.

Speaking of failure to understand, why did Tracey Edwards, an African-American and a registered Democrat who is McGrath's Republican running mate, allow her name to appear on this trashy mailing? Both running mates deserve boos for this campaign.

LOAD-DATE: October 30, 2003

[Reality]

Why is it that liberals and Democrats always fall back on the race card when someone tries to point out the obvious. Take a good look at the barrio called Huntington Station. Better yet, take a stroll up New York Ave. at night in the summertime (if you dare). How can anyone deny what is happening and what has happened here? Do you think apartments over stores will bring more or less shoppers into Huntington Station? Will they bring more or less crowding and crime?

Let's stop all the politically correct pandering and call it what it is.....a slum, a blight in an otherwise nice town. And it is a slum that has been allowed to occur by Huntington Town officials in the name of diversity or whatever the hell else the politically correct call it these days. And that folks is the plain and honest truth of the matter.
________
silver surfer vaporizer (http://vaporizers.net/silver-surfer-vaporizer)

[AntiRacist]

A free toaster to whoever can name who coined the term.

[Fed Up]

You are a demagog for the extreme left. Newsday visciously attacked Mr.McGrath because he had a following. This following resulted from the town of Huntington not enforcing thr building and housing codes in many areas and the hypocrisy surrounding this. Mr.McGrath and many others in the town wanted to protect the town's communities, especially the minority ones with protective legislation. This was called the Nghborhood Preservation Act. This would have allowed inspectors into houses that rented out. The houses would have been inspected for any fire violations and building violations. Nobody was to be put out of a dwelling unless they were in immediate danger. It would have helped to possibly save lives as well as preserve integrity of the nghborhood. It isn't lost on many citizens that the people who slandered Mr.McGrath are also the ones giving out tax money to only a few slumlords at the tune of several million dollars a year. Anytime any citizen or group complains about these slumlords they and thr politician cronies cry racism.
And guess what: not only does the taxpayer suffer but the unfortunate people who are forced to live in these dumps do too. Many of them are minorites. I also ask these posters to read the Long Islander where some Hispanics thanked Mr. McGrath for finally sticking up for them against unscrupulous landlords. It looks like anti-racist is just an opportunist. Maybe he is a slumlord to.
________
mercedes-benz o370 specifications (http://www.mercedes-wiki.com/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_O370)

[Lookie Lookie]

When you have no defense of what you do cry racism and you'll get what you want.

[Anti Racist]

Tell me then, why did McGrath lose the election is he was so great? McGrath was punched in the face for his comments at a board meeting for his comments on these issues. The NAACP said his words had racist overtones. And if anyone is the opportunist, it was McGrath. The voters saw through his crap. I am no slumlord, I just don't call affordable housing initiatives potential slums. I am really done talking about McGrath. He is history. shortwave's overtly racist tone is my beef. You McGrath people need to get a life.

[ChrisF202]

Was McGrath the person who said that illegal aliens in Huntington would be met by baseball bats or something similar?
________
Lesbian Licking (http://www.fucktube.com/categories/736/licking/videos/1)

[gotcha]

Labeling a slur on somebody will work. They who cry racism when there is none succeed in character assassination. Many voters who normally don't follow politics that closely will remember that slander and not vote for the person who was slandered.
To Chris: that was a absurd statement to make. I agree with some of your postings but McGrath is as honest and caring as they come. It's not easy to stand up against a corrupt Democrat political machine in Huntington that is in bed with developers and real estate brokers
(slumlords).:">
________
LovelyWendie (http://www.lovelywendie99.com/)

[New Blue]

Some Immigration-Law Advocates are bigots. Some Anti-Immigration-Law Advocates are bigots. Therefore:

A) All Anti-Immigration-Law Advocates are bigots
B) All Immigration-Law Advocates are bigots
C) Rich McGrath is worth talking about
D) None of the above


Answer: D - None of the Above; In case anyone noticed our President is pushing legislation to render the INS irrelevant. (Not that the INS is currently relevant, but it's nothing untying thr hands and sending them to work couldn't cure.) Let's get on with the discussion, ok?


________
PAXIL SETTLEMENT INFO (http://www.classactionsettlements.org/lawsuit/paxil/)

[mcj]

Just read anti racist remarks. You had be there to see what kind of terrible words and actions were said and done by Joe Devincent. But the real horror was the silence from the Huntington Town Board on this ugly event. Voters in Huntington are so turned off by politics that only a small percentage now bother to vote. By the way if McGrath is a racist so are 16,000 people who voted for him. But we know thats not true and the dems will some day pay for there visciousness and corruptible slander campaign. Just ask Tracy Edwards what kind of Democrats control the Town of Huntington now.
________
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[shortwave]

Of course, the wealthy Newdsday publisher and editors would never tolerate illegal aliens in thr communtities. The publisher of Newsday lives in a beautiful white home with a big old tree out in the front on Llyod Neck causeway. We should judge the Newsday publisher and editors by thr actions. They have chosen to live in racially homogeneous communties.In other words, they really don't like diversity. What they do like is a low wage economy for native born white workers. I'm sure Bart Jones is working his way up to a Llyod Neck home. When the revolt finally occurs, I say hang the bastards from that 300 hundred year old tree in front of the Newsday publishers home. We will start with him first.
________
Yamaha Grizzly 600 Specifications (http://www.yamaha-tech.com/wiki/Yamaha_Grizzly_600)

[shortwave]

I would even kick out legal immigrants from England who write for the national review who came to America on the H1 b VISA program. I would kick out thr chinese wives also. Kick em all out!!! They are all thieves. We have been doormats for too long!!!
________
Ferrari 612 scaglietti history (http://www.ferrari-wiki.com/wiki/Ferrari_612_Scaglietti)