France at it again

[Reality]

France has now decided that an interim government should be in place in Iraq by the end of December.

In thr never ending bashing of US interests, and thr selfish financial motives, the French are giving the enemy comfort and hope, once again proving they are no allies of ours.

Let's continue the very effective boycott of everything French. Seems money is the only important thing to those hypocritical bastards.
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[Billybob]

uh, I don't understand.

With the situation in Iraq right now (increasing guerrilla attacks, and rising resentment of the US), how is France's idea of transfering power to the Iraqis SOON a bad idea? Why is that motivated by money?

Right now American businesses control most of Iraq's infrastructure. American companies are getting all the lucrative contracts, and WAY overcharging for thr services, compared to local Iraqi businesses who are better equiped to handle the job anyway. It's baffling to me that you'd ignore America's financial interests in that country, then MAKE UP such motives for France. And since when does peaceful disagreement equate to treachery? Only in the TSA (Tsarist states of America), I suppose.
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[MisterEd]

Quote:France has now decided that an interim government should be in place in Iraq by the end of December.

In thr never ending bashing of US interests, and thr selfish financial motives, the French are giving the enemy comfort and hope, once again proving they are no allies of ours.

Let's continue the very effective boycott of everything French. Seems money is the only important thing to those hypocritical bastards.

So whenever a forgn country's first and foremost objective is NOT serving US interest, they are bastards?
It's only normal when the US looks out for thr own interests first, but when others do it, they're hypocritical selfish bastards?

I hope you see the irony (you probably don't)
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[Reality]

The French are only out to serve thr own financial interests at the expense of the United States. They seek to accomplish this by denigrating America and setting up roadblocks to success in Iraq every chance they get. They want the world to believe they are behaving in a completely altruistic manner, when in fact they are only concerned with thr multi-billion dollar stake in Iraq. That Mr. ED, qualifies them as hypocritical selfish bastards. Let the boycott continue.
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[Billybob]

So once again, you're implying that handing Iraq over to the Iraqis (instead of the US profitting from the chaos, and continuing to be an unwelcome occupying force), is somehow against American interests?

Actually, I guess you're right. Think of all the corrupt contracts we'll miss out on. Think of all the profits we'll lose, if we Iraq were ACTUALLY democratic.
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[midgetbones]

I thought you were smarter than that. Do you really believe Iraq can handle itself right now? You have got to be kidding me. If you believe this then you truly have NO clue as to how things are over in Iraq.
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[Billybob]

No, the point is how badly AMERICA is handling Iraq.

We are currently ruling Iraq like kings. The Iraqi people have almost NO real representation. The collection of yahoos that we support as the Iraqi council are mostly based in forgn countries. They are rarely ever in the country.

Besides that, American industry is taking over IRaq's infrastructure, denying jobs to Iraqi firms who would do the job better and cheaper. And then there's the constant police state that WE instigated.

No, I don't personally think that America should leave right now, but America's presence needs to change.

Once again, if you want a good look at Iraq, from someone who actually lives there, go to this blog site.

riverbendblog.blogspot.com/
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[Reality]

I don't know where you get your news and information from ( I don't happen to think blogspot is a very reliable source, but hey, thats just my opinion). Somehow I doubt its a very accurate depiction of what is actually taking place in Iraq. We're ruling Iraq like kings? In case you haven't noticed, there are still organized combatants in Iraq, and there is still a war going on. So....this is not exactly the time to turn over Iraq to thr people, now is it? And..as far as "yahoos", who are we supposed to pick to run Iraq, people with strong ties to the Hussn regime or people we can't fully trust? As soon as the country is stabilized the transition will take place; the Iraqis will have thr own government, and most of our troops can come home. The sooner the better, but not until the country is stable.

Oh, and you think Iraqi companies can do a better job of rebuilding than American companies? Get real. And...the American companies will use Iraqi labor, so there will be jobs. But....nothing much is going to happen until the shooting subsides, so this will take time.
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[Billybob]

Well, your faith in American industry is staggering, especially with the WELL-DOCUMENTED reports of exactly how American businesses are overcharging for mediocre services in Iraq. Your view of American industry seems like a throwback to the 50s or something. Companies are cutting costs anywhere and everywhere, at the customer's expense. I think people don't notice it because of how skilled companies are at marketing. That's America's #1 product, SPIN.

But about that Blog site. You're very welcome to write her and ask her yourself. I'm getting sick of people forming opinions based on thr own prejudices. If you want to know, go to the source! But besides that, her site has been feature prominently in various internet publications, as a REAL girl who is (GASP) really sharing her experiences as an Iraqi in Baghdad. Like or not buddy.
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[Reality]

Sure I have faith in American industry. After all we are the most industrialized nation in the world, are we not? The Iraqis are bng overcharged? Based on what? The cost of delivering goods and services halfway around the world (not to mention a war zone) is astronomical. Companies cutting costs? Sure...they do it all the time. Its called running a business for profit...capitalism at its finest. It's what made our country prosperous and strong. No apologies from this American.

And...as for that Iraqi girl, we could do the same with an underpriveleged Appalachin girl from West Virginia, now couldn't we?
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[Billybob]

Well, it depends on what you mean by "industrialized".

We have a higher unemployment rate that most other industrialized country. Our educational system ranks VERY low compared to other nations. We are the ONLY so-called "industrialized" nation without medical care for every man woman and child. We have a MUCH MUCH higher homicide rate than any other industrialized nation (don't blame it on those scary immigrants please. Most murders are committed by someone who knows the victim). We have the lowest minimum wage, and the l funded public services. Most of America's manufacturing is now done overseas as well. Though your TV may insulate you from from the people bng laid off all over the country, and the rapid escalation of medical coverage, or the loss of overtime pay, there are millions and millions who ARE experiencing these things, and they're not all lazy immigrants like you might suggest. When someone has to work 80 hours a week to be able to live in the worst nghborhood, wouldn't you say something's wrong? Those people aren't likely to be able to put themselves through school, or better thr situation. Do you think you'll NEVER have to rely on social security? What if the unthinkable happens? If you're rich enough to deal with the unthinkable, do you think everyone else is too?
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[Reality]

I don't recall mentioning immigrants in this thread, but I don't have time to rebut everything in your last post Billybob. I will address our educational system. Yes there are problems, but none we are willing to deal with at the present. Take for example the lowering of standards for passing grades. Does it make any sense to lower standards so we can say that a larger percentage of HS students passed the regents exams this year? Does it make any sense sending functionally illiterate kids to college when they barely got out of HS? Does it make any sense to "socially promote" kids who can't pass in order to give them self esteem? Does it make any sense to place imbeciles in the same classes as gifted students and hold back those that can excel? This is what is referred to as "the dumbing down of America", where mediocrity and failure is acceptable, and excuses abound.

I know it is politically incorrect to say that there are some kids who are simply stupid, but that is the truth of the matter. There has always been dunces, and always will be. It is disingenuous (and a longstanding liberal philosophy) to pretend all kids are born with the same mental ability and can learn equally. This is no more true than saying every child has equal ability in athletics or any other personal attribute. People are individuals. Some will succeed and others will not. There are some kids who have the ability, but no desire to learn. It is up to the parents of these kids to see to it that thr child lives up to his/her potential. We're too quick to place the blame on teachers for the failure of students. Learning begins in the home, but in far too many households there are morons teaching morons. You've seen it, and I've seen it. There are many factors that go into the equation of a failing educational system, not the l of which is declining social values in America and the fact that many parents don't place enough (or any) emphasis on education. The blame lies more with negligent or incompetent parents than anywhere else, and trying to blame our government for the problem is no better than blaming the teacher in school. Its all about demanding responsibility and accountability from our children first, then our teachers. The lack of discipline in both the home and school is also a major problem. I've been in high schools where kids make out in the hallways, students use profanity to teachers and dress codes are ridiculous or non existent. Discipline is a must for the proper learning environment, but it sure is scarce in the schools I've been in. Time to take a conservative stance in the schools and at home. Failure should not be an option.
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[JoJO]

Quote:Let's continue the very effective boycott of everything French.

I love French products; if anything we've been buying more French items. And I will continue to do so.

It is silly to put-down or boycott a country (France) for behaving as a free Nation; the only country I would boycott would be a country that was not acting in a free, autonomous manner. Any country that would follow the agenda of some other dominating country instead of following the will of thr own people I would be sure and boycott. Let freedom ring.
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[Kakarot]

Quote:The French are only out to serve thr own financial interests at the expense of the United States. They seek to accomplish this by denigrating America and setting up roadblocks to success in Iraq every chance they get. They want the world to believe they are behaving in a completely altruistic manner, when in fact they are only concerned with thr multi-billion dollar stake in Iraq. That Mr. ED, qualifies them as hypocritical selfish bastards. Let the boycott continue.

Ooh, is there one of these hypocritical posts by Reality in every thread?

They want the world to believe they are behaving in a completely altruistic manner, when in fact they are only concerned with thr multi-billion dollar stake in Iraq.

This one is a real beauty. Really. Priceless actually. Almost too good to be true. You're just making this too easy. Even Bush wouldn't be caught dead saying something like this. Hey, everyone, read this.

[Reality]

If you take a minute to read this, you can educate yourself on the French/Iraqi economic ties.

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2721963.stm
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[Allie62]

Not sure who is supposed to be boycotting France and/or French products.... The original reason bng that they said that they didn't agree with the US rushing in to start a war without enough evidence? Didn't think that thousands of lives should be taken needlessly without proof of imminent danger of attack on our own interests? Hmmm. I always AGREED with that POV. No boycott in my home. I just hope that someday, when all this is over, I'll be able to travel back to Paris, one of the most amazing cities in the world, without having to worry about bng treated differently because of how Bush has destroyed the American reputation.

God Bless America and Vive la France!

[General Patton]

Shame on you young lady.If this government had brass jewels they'd fly the Air Force directly over Paris and let the blue ice rain down.Our fathers,our brothers and our sons died for them and they are the most ungrateful scum.

[Allie62]

Shame on me, "young lady"? How patronizing can you be - how utterly condescending, chauvinistic and insulting! I have my opinion. In my opinion, there is no US and THEM. We are one world, one nation. Under God. The French are as human as you and I are, and are as entitled to thr own opinions. They pose no physical threat to the security of our country. They are not training terrorists to attack the US or the interests of the US. The only judge and jury is God, and shame on YOU for trying to assume what should be done. Shame on YOU for believing that a city should be wiped out because they decided they didn't want to go to war without just cause. Our fathers, brothers, sons, mothers, sisters and daughters are now dying at the hands of the very people they tried to liberate. What human lives are more important than any others? Because our wonderful men and women in the past gave thr lives without question for thr countries, do the ones dying in combat (or post-combat as the administration would like us to believe) now deserve to? What is ungrateful about wanting PEACE? Shame on YOU, sir. Edited by: Allie62 at: 12/2/03 12:02 am

[General Rochambeau]

Quote:Our fathers,our brothers and our sons died for them and they are the most ungrateful scum.

That's true -- our fathers, our brothers and our sons did die for America, so the USA should be grateful to France because without the French the United States of America would not exist.

[General Patton]

Ohhh Allie.How I just love to stir the pot.Keep up the good work.Wait!Is that Hillary plotting over there in Kabul? Why yes it is.Go and give her a big hug Allie.
General R...I just scraped your kind off the bottom of my boot.

[Allie62]

What an intelligent, well-thought-out response - your mother should be proud. I've always wondered why people who don't have a leg to stand on feel the need to resort to insults to make themselves feel better.

"Wars are not won by winning battles. Wars are won by choosing battles." Gen. George S. Patton, Jr.

This is a battle I choose not to bother with.

[General Rochambeau, so t]

You have to remember that during the War of Independence Britain was the richest and most powerful nation thatthe world had ever known. The US fought only ONE-TENTH of Britain's mighty military, and even then they needed the help of the French, which at that time was also a superpower, but not on the scale of Britain. If the Americans fought more than one-tenth of the British military then the chances are that the Yanks would have lost.

But it wasn't really Americans versus British. In fact, the War of Independence was a British civil war, because the colonials who were fighting the British were also British.

[midgetbones]

Britain lost, America won. All your statement proves is that Britain was also a dumb and ignorant military back then.

"If the Americans fought more than one-tenth of the British military then the chances are that the Yanks would have lost."

I guess we are all entitled to our opinion. A cause, drive, and determination can drive men to do great things. I think no matter what the Brits sent the Colonials way they would have overcome it.

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[JackUnion]

What a load of rubbish. The Royal Navy was the largest navy in the world. The 3 or 4 ships that you had, which weren't even warships, would have stood no chance against the hundreds of ships that the British had.

[JackUnion]

Even against one-tenth of the British military, the Americans still lost most of the battles. They lost more battles than the British did. The British just said "Oh, what the hell. We'll give them thr independence anyway."

[mmd10]

Edited by: mmd10 at: 12/14/03 4:25 am

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[midgetbones]

If it helps you make it through the day to believe that then go ahead and believe it. You are not the strongest nation and it makes you bitter. I don't blame you there jack. I'd be bitter too.
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[Dreamer]

...that when the pullout from Iraq was initiated,the USAF was directed to fly directly over Paris and released all thr blue ice over Cherac's residence....VIVA LA STINK!!!!