Question about Volunteers vs FDNY

[Unregistered 26]

I am not a fireman, police or anything else.. I'm a corporate guy who doesn't understand why Volunteers are given crap by FDNY or other "paid" guys.

Do they not do the same job? If anything, I would think the guy who does it without getting paid would recve the same praise, if not more. Granted, no high rise buildings and like dangers on the Island.. so thats one for the FDNY.. but overall, do they not display the same bravery by doing the same job in a suburban environment?

[Twix]

I am a volunteer. My father was a paid firefighter for 35 years. I would have loved to have been a paid firefighter. Unfortunately, due to the American tradition of volunteering, most of the counttry is volunteer and very few firefighters are paid. We have the same training, same dedication and as a FDNYer told me, we fight the same fire that kills volunteers and paid firefighters.

I pasted some facts from the NYS Fire Service for you to think about, sorry if it is difficult to read the facts, I had no time to retype them. The link is at http://www.dos.state.ny.us/fire/pdfs/finy/firefacts2.pdf

Here is what the pdf states:
New York State New York State
Fire Resources Fire Resources
1,857
Fire Suppression/
Prevention Organizations
Federal, State, Local and Private
Fire Departments and Fire Brigades
96,593
Volunteer Firefi ghters
17,472
Career Firefi ghters
334
Paid-on-Call Firefi ghters
13,681
Fire Police
5,533
EMS First Responders
17,045
EMT’s
1,849
Paramedics
2,824
Fire Stations
5,563
Engines
1,712
Tankers
915
Aerial Devices
1,046
Ambulances
2,360
Miscellaneous
Vehicles

Can Long Island afford to go completey paid? My taxes doubled when we went with a 24/7 paid EMS crews.

[Unregistered666666]

Actually the training is not the same. How many hours are you required to do out at the nassau or suffolk fire academy??? In nassau you can do it in a week, not sure about suffolk but I am sure it is around the same as opposed to a career academy in which you attend for 3 which is now changed to 4 mos. 8+ hours a day. . I am not looking to debate with you I am only stating facts. But to hear every volly firefighter say we have the same training as our paid counterparts is out of control. I know and have seen very obese men and women which have graduated ,for lack of a better term, the nassau fire academy, when in fact these people would not have even passed a entrance exam for a career dept. So how can the training be the same???? How can someone go through the one week combo class ay the nassau fsa and say they are trained the same as a career firefighter, well I guess you can't now can you??? But as sure as I am going to pay taxes, I bet there will be a boat load of replies telling me I am so stupid and wrong. You are right about one thing fire is a fire and it has no clue who is on the other end of the hose line.

[firefighter firefly]

im a volie for 15 years now (not counting my probie year). i like it think i and my company as well as MOST department members are as if not more proud of bng a firefighter. if some people dont think we do the same as the paid gus do, just tell that to the brothers that went down in a fire .. or after a fire. i personally think a firefighter is a firefighter. i have noticed that most (probably new guys) that are in FDNY ad cocky and thing thr $hit dont stink, then again i am friends with alot of guys that arent that way. its a family we are all in it. we all could learn some things from all the brothers out there. i jst cant stand the pollitics that are involved in it. thats my 2 cents.

[firefighter firefly]

Actually the training is not the same. How many hours are you required to do out at the nassau or suffolk fire academy??? In nassau you can do it in a week, not sure about suffolk but I am sure it is around the same as opposed to a career academy in which you attend for 3 which is now changed to 4 mos. 8+ hours a day. . I am not looking to debate with you I am only stating facts. But to hear every volly firefighter say we have the same training as our paid counterparts is out of control. I know and have seen very obese men and women which have graduated ,for lack of a better term, the nassau fire academy, when in fact these people would not have even passed a entrance exam for a career dept. So how can the training be the same???? How can someone go through the one week combo class ay the nassau fsa and say they are trained the same as a career firefighter, well I guess you can't now can you??? But as sure as I am going to pay taxes, I bet there will be a boat load of replies telling me I am so stupid and wrong. You are right about one thing fire is a fire and it has no clue who is on the other end of the hose line.



im not going to call you stupid or any childish crap like that but, i do know that in my company we drill for about 3 hours 2 days a week and we also drill multiple times durring the year as a department. like i said above this is that we all could learn something from everyone. and yes .. i personally think that the bigger guys should be class "B" firefighters. if the bigger ones go down in a fire... well lets just say more people would have to go in to pull them out .. if they dont drop too.

[mr. training by numbers]

nice training, where was the pre-plan, where were the every two week inspections, where were the search ropes, a complete waist of to good men, for what...so some can wear the brass but conduct serous firefighting business like an ass. engine 10 had the pre fire assignments, but 24/5 house gets screwed. nice job division 1

[UnregisteredII]

Training for the volunteers is as follows:
-Firefighter I must be taken with several weekends devoted to "hands-on" training. This course is taken on your own time....that's the volunteer concept.
-Additional courses such as Heavy Rescue, RIT Training, FF II, Technical Rescue to name a few are taken on your own time. They are not required, but a firefighter needs the course to perform the task. Check the training list of classes and compare the overall time dedicated to training. I will bet it is similar to the paid firefighters training. Also keep in mind that it is the paid FDNYer who is bng paid by the counties to teach these classes.

If you are a paid firefighter you definiteky have the time to dedicate to your community and to protect your own families. Why not join us and show us what we supposedly do not know. You may make a few friends along the way and have a different attitude to the people in your community who are protecting it. Look at the list of dedicated FDNY Chiefs, Officers and firefighters who started as and are still volunteers.

[Not the same]

You cannot put paid Firefighters and Volunteer firefighters on the same playing field at all. Take a look at some of these overwght out of shape people in the volly service. Dont think they are gonna make the stair climb to get to the 15th floor of a project fire carrying a roll up (50ft of 2 1/2 inch hose) or a hook and a can or a life saving rope when the elevators are not working and they never work. And to say Paid Firefighters have the same training as Volunteer Firefighters, no way. As long as you have a pulse you can graduate from the Long Island Fire Academies in 40 hours. FDNY takes only the best and strongest thats why there are so many that wash out and cant make it through. Its physically and academically demanding. If your out of shape or failing your classes you are fired. And you get 23 weeks of rigorous training. Its noble to be a volunteer Firefighter but vollys are not equals to paid Firefighters.

[Unregistered752]

You cannot put paid Firefighters and Volunteer firefighters on the same playing field at all. Take a look at some of these overwght out of shape people in the volly service. Dont think they are gonna make the stair climb to get to the 15th floor of a project fire carrying a roll up (50ft of 2 1/2 inch hose) or a hook and a can or a life saving rope when the elevators are not working and they never work. And to say Paid Firefighters have the same training as Volunteer Firefighters, no way. As long as you have a pulse you can graduate from the Long Island Fire Academies in 40 hours. FDNY takes only the best and strongest thats why there are so many that wash out and cant make it through. Its physically and academically demanding. If your out of shape or failing your classes you are fired. And you get 23 weeks of rigorous training. Its noble to be a volunteer Firefighter but vollys are not equals to paid Firefighters.


You are right, not the same at all....we do your job for free.

[Professional Vollie]

Now thats funny. How about the overwght firefighters that die after alarms and you call them line of duty, they werent over wght they were just seen by the MD!!!I know a couple cases like that. How about the guys that work the RAC Unt that are a little plump? Im sure they are there because they choose to not because they couldnt pass the medical. Come to some of the vollie houses and see how we train, im sure some of us can compare. Im sure if you work on Staten Island your going to jobs on a daily basis right...lmao!!!! Dont make it sound like you are the most fit firefighters in the country. I seen some of you guys as well as you seen some of our guys, we all can use a little time in the gym. As far as saying that we dont do the same job that you guys do, lets say Deutch Bank??? How many guys are going to swing for not doing there job??? We as vollies take it hard when you guys in the city talk down to us like your so professional. You probably dont even have five years on the job yet and if you do your probably from a c house. You were never down a shatty hall way and if you were you were probably talking to youself the entire time because you were scared. You probably never been on the pipe and if you were it was for a dumpster fire. We have some busy houses on the island so cowboy up and join us if not sit there behind your computer and talk trash, but remeber when it comes time and the vollies get tired and join together and say enough is enough and that we wont do anymore seminars from city guys or we dont want city guys at the fire academy teaching you all are going to start singing a different song. If you are such a great firefighter why dont you work at the rock? or are you out of shape and cant do walk ups? Just remember you hit a buttin in your MDT and get more rigs and more men we hit a button and get what we get. Another words we do more with less and that takes a lot of training to utilize what you have not what you can get!!! On that note feel free to start your bashing of the vollies.. Your brother from the

[Not professional]

Professional Vollie no i dont think so your a professional loser wannabe. Go get the Galls catalog order some more blue lights and scanners. All you vollies that knock FDNY are the ones who scored to low on the test or failed the physical and didnt get on. Go race to your automatic alarm now with all your blue flashing lights, speeding and cutting people off. You guys are a disgrace and a joke. Anyone can become a vollie but the best become paid Firefighters. Continue to believe yourself that you are equals. You are in little league. And how dare you say anything regarding the death of two brothers. You are a real piece of cr*p. Do you where 911 T shirts pal like all the vollies or better yet do you have a 911 vollie tatoo those are even better. Where you there? Maybe you were one of the hundreds of vollies who came there without bng requested all you did was get in the way. Im not talking about the vollies staging at the race track. Im talking about all the vollie losers who drove to downtown Manhattan that day thinking they were needed and requested. Stay on your side of the border. You will just get hurt here vollie.

[Unregistered1234567890]

nice training, where was the pre-plan, where were the every two week inspections, where were the search ropes, a complete waist of to good men, for what...so some can wear the brass but conduct serous firefighting business like an ass. engine 10 had the pre fire assignments, but 24/5 house gets screwed. nice job division 1


Don't believe the news. That was your first mistake. The Chiefs that were named and transferred are nothing but scapegoats, and you should know that. Everyone else does. Seems at Bloombergs insistance, a new building inspection law was vetoed by Gov. Spitzer. Remember him, the guy that said this will be investigated so it never happens again?

Seems with the two Brothers buried, the hoopla died down. Nice quiet veto of a law headed the right way..


It's called politics. I'm sure you knew that. And the politics in the FDNY, and other agencies, are as prevalent as the politics in the vollies.

[DOUCHE]

Just Because You Collect A Pay Check Does Not Make You A Professional

[Unregistered2355]

Professional Vollie no i dont think so your a professional loser wannabe. Go get the Galls catalog order some more blue lights and scanners. All you vollies that knock FDNY are the ones who scored to low on the test or failed the physical and didnt get on. Go race to your automatic alarm now with all your blue flashing lights, speeding and cutting people off. You guys are a disgrace and a joke. Anyone can become a vollie but the best become paid Firefighters. Continue to believe yourself that you are equals. You are in little league. And how dare you say anything regarding the death of two brothers. You are a real piece of cr*p. Do you where 911 T shirts pal like all the vollies or better yet do you have a 911 vollie tatoo those are even better. Where you there? Maybe you were one of the hundreds of vollies who came there without bng requested all you did was get in the way. Im not talking about the vollies staging at the race track. Im talking about all the vollie losers who drove to downtown Manhattan that day thinking they were needed and requested. Stay on your side of the border. You will just get hurt here vollie.

At l we don't say we were there if we weren't. I wonder how EVERY FDNY guy made it there that day. I haven't YET met a city fireman that was ther out of state on vacation that day, or out of the country, or out with a broken leg and couldn't get in, etc. etc. etc. Not ONE of you missed that day. I find that amazing. Every one I talk to was there that day. So based on what I've heard, the ENTIRE FDNY staff was at Ground zero on 911. Not one has the ability to admit they were not there. They all want to have the great war story. There just HAD to be someone who was not there that day. I wonder where that person is?

[Get realll]

Perhaps years ago the FDNY only took the "best of the best," but those days are LOOONG gone. Hiring standards are ridiculously lowered, females don't have to pass the same physical tests (although they still respond to the same calls!), and the FDNY has seriously dumbed-down the test in an effort to hire a more "diverse" class.

Cream of the crop my ass. As I said, maybe 20 years ago, but now just look at what's getting on the job. Puh-leeeeeze.....

[BIG BAD FIREMAN]

Professional Vollie no i dont think so your a professional loser wannabe. Go get the Galls catalog order some more blue lights and scanners. All you vollies that knock FDNY are the ones who scored to low on the test or failed the physical and didnt get on. Go race to your automatic alarm now with all your blue flashing lights, speeding and cutting people off. You guys are a disgrace and a joke. Anyone can become a vollie but the best become paid Firefighters. Continue to believe yourself that you are equals. You are in little league. And how dare you say anything regarding the death of two brothers. You are a real piece of cr*p. Do you where 911 T shirts pal like all the vollies or better yet do you have a 911 vollie tatoo those are even better. Where you there? Maybe you were one of the hundreds of vollies who came there without bng requested all you did was get in the way. Im not talking about the vollies staging at the race track. Im talking about all the vollie losers who drove to downtown Manhattan that day thinking they were needed and requested. Stay on your side of the border. You will just get hurt here vollie.



with this said im glad and proud that im a vollie. this is my point that the makority of the brothers on the job in ny are so full of them selves. if youre wondering ... NO i didnt take the test, NO i dont want to be on the job (call me crazy but i rather make my $80k a year then the $30K), yes i went to GZ on the 11th and YES i had a thank you from your GODLIKE firefighters there. if you realy think you are so better than us, you just need to look around. i seen you people fight a fire .. i guess breaking glass is a cool thing to do. as far as i know we try to SAVE the property ... not destroy it. its because of you and your thinking abotrion is around....

[UnregisteredIII]

Hey guys, a simple question has once again turned into a debate of machoism. "I'm better than you."

For the FDNYers who have a problem with the volley's: TALK TO YOUR LEADERS WHO ARE VOLUNTEERS!!! You will soon learn that you have a group of dedicated individuals who are part of thr community. They do the best that they can with a tremendous amount dedication and enthusiasm. Give them credit.

If you live on Long Island, understand that if we went with a paid 24/7 fire service, your fire tax would triple. Ah yes, someone is probably going to debate this. The facts are true, your taxes will go way up. Why do you think the politicians are avoiding the subject?

What is sad is the fact that the UFA and UFOA breaks FDNYers chops if they find out they are volley's. The unions job is drum up new sources of revenue. I would bet that the bashing would stop if the UFA created a volunteer section for thr union.

Is Long Island burning away? Have some respect for guys like Peter Lund who died VOLUNTEERING to do what he was trained to do. I respected this man and became a volunteer because he motivated me into caring about my community.

Oh, if you do not know who Peter Lund was, maybe you do not know as much as you think you know about the VOLUNTEER FIRE SERVICE.

[Ibangvollies'wives]

Gee why is it that most vollie dept sops are carbon copies of FDNY. Why do vollies and vollie dispatchers talk like FDNY on your radios. I wish i had a nickel for every time i heard "K" or "10-4" on your vollie radios. Vollie trucks ride with "Irons" "Can" "OV" "Roof" positions right? Where do you think those positions were invented? Let me tell you by the FDNY. Everything you vollie losers do is a copy of FDNY. No matter what you say the FDNY is the biggest and best Fire Department in the world. I see a lot of vollies wearing FDNY clothing but I never seem to see FDNY guys wearing vollie clothing. And as far as the city changing the hiring standards that may be true but the academy "The Rock" is harder now then it ever has been to compensate for that. It is designed to filter out the weak and it does just that. Every class losses at l 30 people for bng out of shape or dumb. And to the mutt bringing up 911 so close to the anniversary shut your mouth. You do not even have the right to speak of that day. How dare you discredit the 343 brothers who were lost that day. You piece of sh*t you say you have yet to meet an FDNY guy who wasnt there. Well d*ckhead thats why we lost so many guys beacuse off duty guys came from home and guys who just left the firehouses, getting off thr tour, turned around and came back. And this was long before the recall. I dispise you vollies and this is why. Keep thinking your real. mey2qg

[Pro Vollie]

You stated that vollies self dispatched themselves to GZ sounds like you guys did the same thing!!!! So its ok for you to do it and call yourselves heroes but for a vollie to do it hes a buff??? As far as us having so many blue lights dont be jealous we dont get to lay on our backs with 10 toes up and get fat and collect a pay check. We actually have to get out of bed or leave dinner to go to the fire house which takes more dedication than bng a sand bagger at a slow house hidding behind 100 years of tradition and ridding the coat tales of all the MEN before you that made FDNY what it is. You sit here on a computer and bash vollies but when a firefighter goes down and hes from long island its ok to use a vollie house and drink there beer and if he was a vollie its ok to sit down with them and have a couple and tell your STORIES to the young guys that look up to you because most of there life they always wanted to be a firefighter. You my friend are a pail of sheet!! Most FDNY members are ok with the vollies you were thrown out of a vollie house and are disgruntal. You should hang out with Mrs. Moore you both have a lot in common. Well love to stay and chat but have to add more blue lights to my car so I can cut you off...lol...

[Unregistered6666666]

[QUOTE=UnregisteredIII;163316]
If you live on Long Island, understand that if we went with a paid 24/7 fire service, your fire tax would triple. Ah yes, someone is probably going to debate this. The facts are true, your taxes will go way up. Why do you think the politicians are avoiding the subject?

Yes you are correct someone is going to debate this, you state the facts are true. What facts???? There are no facts.....Please stop with all the lies, the only reason the politicians are avoiding it is because they are afraid to lose votes, they don't want to stir up the hornets nest. You are all so quick to bash L. Moore because the truth hurts. Were somethings she printed alittle off maybe but she foiled the info. so if it was stretched it was still based on truth. One last thing, to the vollys who still want to be a professional firefighter some day if the counties or towns or even individual Depts. went full paid or combo. some of you just might get a job you love.

[Unregistered2355]

Gee why is it that most vollie dept sops are carbon copies of FDNY. Why do vollies and vollie dispatchers talk like FDNY on your radios. I wish i had a nickel for every time i heard "K" or "10-4" on your vollie radios. Vollie trucks ride with "Irons" "Can" "OV" "Roof" positions right? Where do you think those positions were invented? Let me tell you by the FDNY. Everything you vollie losers do is a copy of FDNY. No matter what you say the FDNY is the biggest and best Fire Department in the world. I see a lot of vollies wearing FDNY clothing but I never seem to see FDNY guys wearing vollie clothing. And as far as the city changing the hiring standards that may be true but the academy "The Rock" is harder now then it ever has been to compensate for that. It is designed to filter out the weak and it does just that. Every class losses at l 30 people for bng out of shape or dumb. And to the mutt bringing up 911 so close to the anniversary shut your mouth. You do not even have the right to speak of that day. How dare you discredit the 343 brothers who were lost that day. You piece of sh*t you say you have yet to meet an FDNY guy who wasnt there. Well d*ckhead thats why we lost so many guys beacuse off duty guys came from home and guys who just left the firehouses, getting off thr tour, turned around and came back. And this was long before the recall. I dispise you vollies and this is why. Keep thinking your real. mey2qg

Learn to read jackass! First of all, I have the right to speak of whatever I want and your over-inflated-ego ass can't do anything about it. Second, I would never discredit the 343 who died and if you had some basic reading comprehension skills you would have been able to figure that out from what I wrote. I'm actually discrediting those who were not there yet whenever the topic comes up, somehow they were there on that day. They just have to have the war story for themselves, and that's what's more important to them, the war story. And for the record, you can spend your life despising vollies. I couldn't care less. I don't do it to impress the mighty FDNY guys or to be like them. I do it because I want to. I lose absolutely NO sleep knowing there are some city guys that have a volly hang-up. Again. Don't care. Oh, and that's real tough talk with the whole d*ckhead thing. You sure told me! You're a credit to the service.

[Sick & Tired FF]

this whole thread is out of line. the FDNY has the right to be proud of thr department, as do all the volunteer departments. i, for one, will never forget the 343 FDNY firemen who died on 9/11, but i will also not forget the 23 NYPD cops, 37 PAPD cops, and nearly 2500 civilians on top of all that. it was a terrible day and the shame is that we all forget it. unfortunately, 2 more city firemen gave thr lives on almost the same site in a building that was damaged on 9/11, but we shouldn't be criticizing those bosses who were reassigned until the facts come out. for all we know, they could be the ones who were thrown under the bus. it seems like you're throwing a dig back at the FDNY guys who are crapping on the vollies claiming to be better, but some of you are sinking lower than they are.

the facts are that if nassau county went paid, taxes would go up...not a little, but a lot. do nassau departments borrow from FDNY training, standards, and experience? sure we do, but on some level, every department borrows from somewhere else. i love new york and i think it's the greatest place on earth, but putting "NY" on something doesn't automatically make it better...you've gotta earn it.

i respect the job that FDNY firemen do every day, but i also respect firemen in los angeles, chicago, boston, newark, yonkers, and everywhere else. the term BMA (brother my ass) didn't come out of nowhere. we're in a macho business and over the years, we've turned into our own worst enemies. there's no real brotherhood, it's all a myth. everyone is out for themselves and to stroke thr own egos, and i hate it.

every firefighter whose response area has a little more fire than somewhere else, they look down upon them. many FDNY guys don't respect other paid firemen as much as they should, be they from garden city, long beach, or los angeles, because they might work in a busier area. on the other hand, most nassau county guys don't respect firemen upstate or in ohio, because we have more fires and better equipment. we're all hypocrites. if we all followed the rules and learned to get along, maybe one day we're ACTUALLY be a brotherhood. until then, we'll all be keyboard cowboys talking crap on a stupid message board.

i've got enough time in the fire service as a volunteer firefighter and an officer to know my job and i trust my skills and my company's skills because we drill regularly and have a lot of salty experienced members (some FDNY, some NCFSA, some none of the above) who have mentored the newer guys who came in after the days of heavy fire duty died down. will i compare them to any other company or department? absolutely not, because that's the cancer of our culture.

vollies, stop plastering your cars with your "no fear firefighting" and your graphic t-shirts with a dog with big muscles in turnout gear...if you think you look cool, i'm sorry to tell you that i vomit in my mouth a little everytime i see it. stop shopping for equipment at buff shows that you don't know how to use, stop bragging about how great you are without having the fire duty experience, and stop ragging on the city, because it makes you look jealous.

FDNY, stop looking down on every other fire department in the world because you have FDNY on the back of your coat. stop pissing on the NYPD and ESU, makes you look jealous that the city doesn't give you guys a gun too. stop getting locked up and getting your faces in the paper. just do your job, try to enjoy your 20 years, spread the knowledge, and people will respect you a hell of a lot more for it.

that's all the free wisdom i'll give out on the internet. if anyone else wants to pick my brain, buy me a drink and we'll talk.

[Unregistered4414]

And with that, this thread should just lay down and die because I don't think anybody could add to that, much less criticize it. As a combined FDNY AND volly, I thank you for those words.

[UnregisteredIII]

And with that, this thread should just lay down and die because I don't think anybody could add to that, much less criticize it. As a combined FDNY AND volly, I thank you for those words.

AMEN

[Unregistered 26]

Thanks for some good information and dialog.

[Comboman]

Brother, you have said it all. way to go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Unregistered870]

There are hefty boys on both sides of the city line, (just look at your senior engine chauffeurs). That aside, saying the 80 hour combo class is not the same as the FDNY academy is also a skewed statement. The combo class is just the basic firefighting skills, add 36 hours for Hazmat operations, 80 hours for EMS training (yes the BS "FDNY invented CFR-D" curriculum), plus the engine, and ladder operations class, basic ropes, all the hours of running and gym time, weeks of time used learning FDNY specific protocol, not to mention how many hours of my life I wasted standing in straight lines and rows, and doing unnecessary push-ups because of the retard next to me. So now your 2 weeks vs. 24 week argument really becomes 10 vs. 16 at best.

The summation of the story really is that it depends on the individual and how dedicated they are to the fire service. There is no argument you can make that would prevent an individual volunteer from taking training and classes to becoming equal or better than any paid fireman, the converse is also true there are many paid firemen that are head and shoulders above many vollies. However there are also rejects on both sides, this is evident because if everyone was perfect we would never lose brothers or buildings.

Please take a minute and reflect before you draw conclusions about who your looking down at, are you really better than them. Paid guys, have you never made a bad call on a fire ground? Vollies, could a paid guy be just as good as you? The answer is most definitely yes to both questions. I the end we should all act and treat each others as peers....and to the fat guys......put the fried food down your not helping anyone.

[on both sides.]

Gee why is it that most vollie dept sops are carbon copies of FDNY. Why do vollies and vollie dispatchers talk like FDNY on your radios. I wish i had a nickel for every time i heard "K" or "10-4" on your vollie radios. Vollie trucks ride with "Irons" "Can" "OV" "Roof" positions right? Where do you think those positions were invented? Let me tell you by the FDNY. Everything you vollie losers do is a copy of FDNY. No matter what you say the FDNY is the biggest and best Fire Department in the world. I see a lot of vollies wearing FDNY clothing but I never seem to see FDNY guys wearing vollie clothing. And as far as the city changing the hiring standards that may be true but the academy "The Rock" is harder now then it ever has been to compensate for that. It is designed to filter out the weak and it does just that. Every class losses at l 30 people for bng out of shape or dumb. And to the mutt bringing up 911 so close to the anniversary shut your mouth. You do not even have the right to speak of that day. How dare you discredit the 343 brothers who were lost that day. You piece of sh*t you say you have yet to meet an FDNY guy who wasnt there. Well d*ckhead thats why we lost so many guys beacuse off duty guys came from home and guys who just left the firehouses, getting off thr tour, turned around and came back. And this was long before the recall. I dispise you vollies and this is why. Keep thinking your real. mey2qg

No fan of the vollies with thr bullshit, but cut some slack here. TOO MANY times have the vollies opened thr doors for US with TOO MANY LODD'S. Try not to forget how many VOLLIE ladder arches our caisson passed under. And don't forget how many vollie rigs were in our firehouses covering our areas while WE were looking for our Brothers, ESU, PAPD and civilian victims.

As for positioning on rigs, well you can say imitiation is the sincerest form of flattery. But you can also say that like our job, assigned positions minimize freelancing, and makes sure the vital jobs are done. Seems many of our Brothers teach out at suburban fire academies as spread the knowledge as well.

Thank God the Rock is getting tougher. While many vollies came on with an attitude, many also have not. And with what the Vulcans want on our job at any price, I'll take a snot nosed vollie buff who many be into the job, than one of the Vulcan skells who wants a paycheck, and won't lift a finger any more than he has to. I would hate to be a DI or Instructor at the rock with a class of Vulcans. EVERY move they make will be under a microscope, and even a sneeze will bring cries of racism. The vollie we get some well deserved ball breaking, and take it without crying racism.

Yes, the FDNY is still the best in the world. I have as much pride as you. But I've seen our guys railroaded by vollies while they kept skells who fit in thr cliques. It's thr loss and thr communities, not ours. And even with ALL the warnings we give our Brothers to watch thr asses because the papers will make a big deal out of it, they still f**K up. At l our guys will be heavily punished or fired, vollies usually keep them if they are in the right clique.

Nther organization is perfect, and we on Long Island have a double edged sword. I would love to see a fully paid Dept. in my town with a fast response, but would be tough to live here tax wise. Even with the waste of money on dinners and racing toys and other crap, that money won't support a fully paid Dept. And with vollies working 2-3 jobs like us, well response times aint what they used to be.

But the vollies have jerkoff like we do, and nothing is held back when we have a LODD.

FYI, what we call the "GREATEST" Dept in the world REFUSED a caisson for a Brother from E-234 who died last year from 9/11 illnesses. OUR top Brass even called the Blue Point FD demanding they NOT use a vollie rig as a caisson. Some 'Brotherhood', huh? Made me sick.

That Brother was a vollie there and they told our FC and COD to shove it. Another vollie rig carried a well respected BC nicknamed "Black Cloud" to his final resting place as well. Mineola, I think.

Like I said, we have our jerkoffs and they have thrs. I laugh at the clowns with the 10,000 blue lights, but look at the Hatzolah vollies in the city as well.
See what Hatzolah gives us when we get another LODD. But we know what the vollies in the suburbs will give us.

JMO.

Stay safe.

[Why I Do It]

But the vollies have jerkoff like we do, and nothing is held back when we have a LODD.

FYI, what we call the "GREATEST" Dept in the world REFUSED a caisson for a Brother from E-234 who died last year from 9/11 illnesses. OUR top Brass even called the Blue Point FD demanding they NOT use a vollie rig as a caisson. Some 'Brotherhood', huh? Made me sick.

That Brother was a vollie there and they told our FC and COD to shove it. Another vollie rig carried a well respected BC nicknamed "Black Cloud" to his final resting place as well. Mineola, I think.

Like I said, we have our jerkoffs and they have thrs. I laugh at the clowns with the 10,000 blue lights, but look at the Hatzolah vollies in the city as well.
See what Hatzolah gives us when we get another LODD. But we know what the vollies in the suburbs will give us.

JMO.

Stay safe.


Like you said, there are jerkoff's everywhere. In our (Vollie) case, they're noticed a lot more than yours due to thr stupid “I fight what you fear” stickers & 30 Blue Lights.

Truth be told, most Vollie Departments that I've had anything to do with have been filled & for the most part run by current or former FDNY guys. In my house, we look to the FDNY guys for thr guidance & value thr opinion greatly. Yes, 90% of our SOP’s are taken from the FDNY, why? Because they’ve been proven to be effective! Guys, we have how many jobs a year, 5? 10? Maybe! This is why we look to the dept that has the experience of THOUSANDS of jobs per year. I don’t know about you, but learning from another’s experience isn’t only common sense, but it’s good business.

I have a great job & make a great living but wanted to help people someway. I've been able to fulfill my needs through bng a FD & EMS Vollie. Call it what you want, I don't care. I can look my wife & kids in the eye and know I've busted my ass to achieve a level of success professionally & been able to do something good in the world too. That's what it's all about for me.

I can tell you one thing though, I don't care how much shit is talked about us Vollies by some, I have always, & will always burn vacation days from my fulltime job, take time from my family, & do whatever I have to do to honor a fallen brother. It has been an honor to pay my respect to the many fallen firefighters over the years, weather you respect me or not.

Stay safe!

[so true555]

this whole thread is out of line. the FDNY has the right to be proud of thr department, as do all the volunteer departments. i, for one, will never forget the 343 FDNY firemen who died on 9/11, but i will also not forget the 23 NYPD cops, 37 PAPD cops, and nearly 2500 civilians on top of all that. it was a terrible day and the shame is that we all forget it. unfortunately, 2 more city firemen gave thr lives on almost the same site in a building that was damaged on 9/11, but we shouldn't be criticizing those bosses who were reassigned until the facts come out. for all we know, they could be the ones who were thrown under the bus. it seems like you're throwing a dig back at the FDNY guys who are crapping on the vollies claiming to be better, but some of you are sinking lower than they are.

the facts are that if nassau county went paid, taxes would go up...not a little, but a lot. do nassau departments borrow from FDNY training, standards, and experience? sure we do, but on some level, every department borrows from somewhere else. i love new york and i think it's the greatest place on earth, but putting "NY" on something doesn't automatically make it better...you've gotta earn it.

i respect the job that FDNY firemen do every day, but i also respect firemen in los angeles, chicago, boston, newark, yonkers, and everywhere else. the term BMA (brother my ass) didn't come out of nowhere. we're in a macho business and over the years, we've turned into our own worst enemies. there's no real brotherhood, it's all a myth. everyone is out for themselves and to stroke thr own egos, and i hate it.

every firefighter whose response area has a little more fire than somewhere else, they look down upon them. many FDNY guys don't respect other paid firemen as much as they should, be they from garden city, long beach, or los angeles, because they might work in a busier area. on the other hand, most nassau county guys don't respect firemen upstate or in ohio, because we have more fires and better equipment. we're all hypocrites. if we all followed the rules and learned to get along, maybe one day we're ACTUALLY be a brotherhood. until then, we'll all be keyboard cowboys talking crap on a stupid message board.

i've got enough time in the fire service as a volunteer firefighter and an officer to know my job and i trust my skills and my company's skills because we drill regularly and have a lot of salty experienced members (some FDNY, some NCFSA, some none of the above) who have mentored the newer guys who came in after the days of heavy fire duty died down. will i compare them to any other company or department? absolutely not, because that's the cancer of our culture.

vollies, stop plastering your cars with your "no fear firefighting" and your graphic t-shirts with a dog with big muscles in turnout gear...if you think you look cool, i'm sorry to tell you that i vomit in my mouth a little everytime i see it. stop shopping for equipment at buff shows that you don't know how to use, stop bragging about how great you are without having the fire duty experience, and stop ragging on the city, because it makes you look jealous.

FDNY, stop looking down on every other fire department in the world because you have FDNY on the back of your coat. stop pissing on the NYPD and ESU, makes you look jealous that the city doesn't give you guys a gun too. stop getting locked up and getting your faces in the paper. just do your job, try to enjoy your 20 years, spread the knowledge, and people will respect you a hell of a lot more for it.

that's all the free wisdom i'll give out on the internet. if anyone else wants to pick my brain, buy me a drink and we'll talk.