Rep. McCarthy wants to repeal the 2nd amendment

[NRA Member]

Rep. Carolyn McCarthy has intoduced H.R. 2038 which is so restrictive it would ban most modern firearms. While reasonable people are sympathetic to the personal tragedy she has suffered, that sympathy ends when she feels that her personal tragedy gives her the right to destroy our nation. Many died so we can be free and their widows did not try to destroy our rights and our nation.
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[great scot]

I am sure you stand by your credo, "You can take my gun, over my cold dead body"

Someday I am sure one of your buddy members will do just that..

You allow guns to be owned by Chuck Heston, If he remembers, how the damn thing works
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[NRA Member]

Great Scot,
The phrase you are referring to is:
"From my cold dead hands"
- Charlton Heston-
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[great scot]

" Whatever"

I really didn't rank the phrase upmthere with any of my Churchill Chronicals
________
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[Sunrise12]

I may not know much about guns. what I do know is this: An 8 year old relative of mine in Florida was injured last year. He went to play at a friends house and his 9 year old friend decided to take out his father's gun and play with it. My relative was shot by the friend in the leg.turned out the father was a felon who was turned down for buying a gun after a background check, but just went and bought the gun at one of your famous gun shows without a problem. Please, don't insult my intelligence with your "men have died for our rights" rah-rah crap. It doesn't wash with most of us.

[NRA Member]

Sunrise12,
Any loss of life is tragic whether it be man, woman or child. With that being said, the anti-gunners seem to focus on children frequently , possibly in an attempt to turn a rational argument into an emotional argument. Guns have also saved the lives of children, a fact most anti-gunners ignore or don't have the ability to comprehend. In closing, I would like to say that personally I don't care what will and will not "wash with most of you." In terms if importance the second amendment is first!
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[knows better]

The 1st Amendment is "first" in all ways. You can figure out the rest, militiaman.

[Miniver]

NRA Member:

Please fill us in on what you do with your guns. Do you take them to the shooting range and use them there? Do you take them hunting? If so, what type of guns do you use to shoot the animals? Do you lock them up and keep the bullets separate? Do you have children in the house? Do you live in an area where the Redcoats are constantly popping up?

[Questioner]

About 350 children under age 5 die each year in this country from drowning in swimming pools, far more than are killed by guns.

Do you advocate a swimming pool ban? If it is about the lives of children, wouldn't it make more sense to use the effort go after something that causes the most death?

[Sunrise12]

you guys find every type of excuse to rationalize things. it's amazing to me that you guys can't accept a short waiting period to check someones background and make sure there not a mental patient or a felon. They'res just no talking to you guys.

[NRA Member]

Miniver,
Are you making a rational post or attempting to interrogate? I suggest you review the fourth amendment. In case you forgot(or never knew) the first ten amendments are known as the Bill of Rights.
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[Miniver]

You say that you are an NRA member. I am not an NRA member. Some tend to associate the NRA with the Midwest and the South, and not Long Island. As such, I am inquiring as to the reasons that you have your guns. I think that it would shed some light, as opposed to the "Guns are bad" vs. "Guns are constitutionally protected" argument that is going to play out here.

[NRA Member]

Miniver,
The NRA is active in all 50 states. Obviously some states have more members than other states just like any other national organization. I, like many other Long Island residents am not a native Long Islander. In case you haven't heard Charlton Heston is no longer the president. Kayne Robinson is the new NRA president.
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[stjohnixx]

Why are you talking about the 4th? Are you suggesting that guns be used against law enforcement or that the 4th allows such things?

Also, a quick glance at the 2nd shows pretty clearly but apparantly not clear to NRA members that the rights contained in the 2nd are contingent on being "well regulated."

[NRA Member]

Stjohnixx,
To answer the first part of your post..Definitely not.
To answer the second part of your post "well-regulated" in the lingo of the day meant well trained or competent. It has nothing to do with government regulations. If you go to the National Issues Discussion Board you can see my entire explanation of the second amendment phrase by phrase.
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[stjohnixx]

"To answer the second part of your post "well-regulated" in the lingo of the day meant well trained or competent. It has nothing to do with government regulations."

That is the fantasy that the NRA has been trying to sell for years. Ain't true.

[NRA Member]

stjohnixx,
You know nothing about the second amendment. Read the debates on the drafting of the second amendment. Look at which proposed drafts were found unacceptable and why. The true intent of the second amendment is clear. Research early Supreme Court interpretations of the second amendment such as:
Logan vs. U.S. 1892
Miller vs. Texas 1893
Robertson vs. Baldwin 1897
Maxwell vs. Dow 1900


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[Liddy]

Anything a little more current than 1900?

[NRA Member]

Liddy,
The point is: the older the case, the closer it is to the drafting of the second amendment and thus the more weight that decision carries. There was a 1939 case. Nothing since 1939. Keep in mind the Supreme Court itself selects what cases it wants to hear. The interpretation will not change with time. The second amendment is an individual right to keep and bear arms.
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[no guns here]

NRA member, do you really think they would have drafted the 2nd amendment if they knew 14 year old kids were gonna be bring assault weapons to school and killing there classmates?

[stjohnixx]

more on the USSC later but...

"Liddy,
The point is: the older the case, the closer it is to the drafting of the second amendment and thus the more weight that decision carries. "

So technically Dred Scott holds more weight than any other USSC decision on race?


<<There was a 1939 case. Nothing since 1939.>>

Glossing over 1939.


<<Keep in mind the Supreme Court itself selects what cases it wants to hear. The interpretation will not change with time. The second amendment is an individual right to keep and bear arms.>>

"Well Regulated" is the key. Also, what do YOU consider arms? The "arms" or rather guns in the late 1700's were single shot muskets or long guns. I would be all for the original intent of the 2nd where you can own a musket. Feel free to carry one openly. Heston was being quite dishonest when he held up the single shot rifle. He should have held up a semi-automatic or an Uzi but then regular folks would be aghast.

[NRA Member]

stjohnixx,
You brought up an interesting point. One I argue all the time. When the second amendment was drafted, muskets were the arm of the day. That means citizens and government alike had the same level of arm. As technology grew the gap between level of arms in the hands of citizens and level of arms in the hands the government grew. The level of arm in the hands of citizens is over-restricted.
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[stjohnixx]

<<You brought up an interesting point. One I argue all the time. When the second amendment was drafted, muskets were the arm of the day. That means citizens and government alike had the same level of arm. As technology grew the gap between level of arms in the hands of citizens and level of arms in the hands the government grew. The level of arm in the hands of citizens is over-restricted.>>

Citizens did not own cannon and other forms of artillery. They did not possess war ships. Are you suggesting that to cathc up citizens today should be aremd with tactical nuclear devices or tanks? You seem to believe that the 2nd is some sort of field leveling when it is certainly not.

[NRA Member]

stjohnixx,
The musket to musket argment lends itself to the extrapolation you indicated. However, entertaining that extrapolation takes us to the subject of balance of power between the government and the governed. The framers wrestled with this very issue. The issue of power. A government that is too weak to govern is not a government at all. Anarchy, chaos, local mobocracies, etc. will be the result. Hardly anything that resembles a nation. On the other hand a government that is too powerful with respect to the governed will surely become a tyranny, exercising absolute power. So the framers gave us a government that is strong enough to govern our great nation, but also provided the governed the Bill of Rights(the tools) to prevent tyranny.
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[ON TARGET]

enough of all this NRA rhetoric horsecrap. Kids are dying out there becasue of access to guns. They shoulde rewrite the damn constitution...
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[NRA Member]

on target,
You display a child-like mentality on this subject.

"From my cold dead hands"
-Charlton Heston-

[ON TARGET]

"kiss my cold dead ass". Next thing, you'll be walking through Long Island with white sheets over your heads.
________
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[ON TARGET]

what's it like to belong to an organization that the rest of the general public thinks is nuts?
________
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[NRA Member]

on target,
I am proud to be a citizen of the U.S. I am proud to be pro-law enforcement. And I am proud to be an NRA Member.
________
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[ON TARGET]

good for you, Do you oppose a waiting period to see if soemone attempting to purchase a gun has a history of mental incompetance, such as Peter Troy, who murdered a priest in a Lynbrook church?
________
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[NRA Member]

on target,
Please go to the National Issues board and click on "The anti-gunners arguments" thread for your answer.
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[ON TARGET]

come on, let's hear your answer on this one after a man with a history of mental illness walked into a Long Island gun shop and bought a gun without a mental history background check and blew away a catholic priest....come on, you like to talk alot, let's hear your answer for everyone to see.
________
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[NRA Member]

on target,
I have already answered someone else who proposed this same inept point, but here it is again.

It is like this. If you are:
a) a criminal-you belong in jail
b) mentally unsound-you belong in an institution
c) an illegal alien-you should be deported

However if you are a law-abiding citizen of the U.S. your right to bear arms shall not be infringed. Our nation was founded on the concept of people governing themselves. With freedom comes responsibility. So to reiterate, if you are a criminal, mentally unsound, or an illegal alien you do not belong walking around on the streets of the U.S.
Is this simple enough for you to grasp?
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[ON TARGET]

I GRASP IT. YOU THINK PETER TROY, REGARDLESS OF HIS HISTORY OF SEVERE MENTAL ILLNESS AND VIOLENCE HAS THE RIGHT TO BEAR A WEAPON AND MURDER A CATHOLIC PRIEST......YOU REALLY ARE PATHETIC.
________
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[NRA Member]

on target,
I will entertain this point one last time. Your ability to grasp the answer seems impaired. If someone has a history of mental problems they belong in an institution. If we don't have enough institutions, we can build more. However the rights of law-abiding U.S. citizens shall not be infringed because of someone with a history of mental problems or criminal problems or any other kind of problems. A person with those kind of problems does not belong walking around in a free society.
________
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[ON TARGET]

I think we get a real good understanding of where you're coming from. ANYONE, reagrdless of whether they've committed felonies before, have a history of violence or mental illness, no matter what bad things they've ever done in there lives before, still has the right to own a weapon. I think you've laid it out pretty good as to what you're all about.
________
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[NRA Member]

on target,
Anyone who can not grasp the concept that criminals belong in jail and the mentally unsound belong in an institution might try the following:
1) With your right hand, grab your right ear
2) With your left hand, grab your left ear
3) Pull your head out of your rear-end
________
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[ON TARGET]

I want a simple yes or no answer:....Should someone with a history of violence and mental illness be permitted to walk into a gunshop and purchase the gun of his choosing without a problem?
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[NRA Member]

on target,
That was your best post. I will answer your question. The answer is: NO, such a person should not be able to walk into a gun store and buy a gun because such a person should be in prison or a mental institution and should not be walking around at all.
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[ON TARGET]

But if he's out on the street, despite his history, he should be able to buy a gun?
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[NRA Member]

on target,
In theory NO, but in reality there is no way to implement a system that would prevent such a person from legally buying a gun without infringing on the rights of law-abiding citizens. This is why criminals MUST be in prison and the mentally unsound MUST be in an institution.
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[ON TARGET]

FOR GET ABOUT "IN THEORY"..SHOULD THEY OR SHOULDN'T THEY..ANSWER THE QUESTION ALREADY
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[NRA Woman]

I am a Woman and I fully support the NRA. I have been Licensed to carry a firearm since the Age of 24. What got me interested was My Grandfather. He taught me how to RESPECT a Firearm. If Adults today taught their Children how to respect a firearm, You will not be hearing about Children Shooting other Children by accident. I have introduced my children ages 8 and 4 how to respect a Firearm. Just like what Eddie Eagle Demonstrates. If you teach your Children at a young age about firearms , they will not grow Curious about one when they Grow older.

[NRA Member]

on target,
You don't have a question or the mentality to grasp an answer even if you did have a question. You do illustrate however that for effective communication to take place a common language is required. Have you ever considered learning to understand English?
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[ON TARGET]

No problem Mr. Kazynski....How are the woods these days?
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[ON TARGET]

You seem to have a serious problem with answering a question that's posed to you time and time again...
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[ON TARGET]

Why is the NRA opposed to gun-free school zones?
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[The Juror]

Well, there should be a little less pro-NRA postings this week, as I think they took away the Nazi Janitor's PC.

[NRA Member]

The Juror,
You are a perfect example of why the Founders in their wisdom selected a 12 person jury, (fro criminal cases) however that is another subject. The more you understand the founding concepts of our great republic, the more you will appreciate the genius of the founders on the subject of government.
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[Sunrise one]

forget all the other dialogue up until now. i need an honest opinion from your view about something"

A sixth grader recently brought a pellet gun that fires plastic yellow pellets to the schoolyard and shot two 5th graders at the local elementary school. After police reports were filed, the school district suspended the boy for 2 days who did the shooting. The school weapons policy calls for a MANDATORY one year expulsion for anyone bringing a weapon onto school grounds. The pellet gun is defined as a weapon in accordance with section 921, title 18 of the US code from the gun-free scxhools act of 1994......without partisan opinion on the right to bear arms involved in this, whats your opinion of the light suspension?

[NRA Member]

Sunrise one,
Aggression comes from the human mind. Our youth must be taught from a young age that unprovoked aggression is unacceptable and it will not be tolerated. If you abuse your precious freedom you will lose it. In a free society the individual MUST take responsibility for his actions.

In this case I would leave the lenght of suspension(if any) at the discretion of the appropriate person in the school system. However I would require a MANDATORY duration of one-half semester in a special ed/problem child class for any child that iniates unprovoked aggression with or without a weapon.
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[onlyalad]

Your answer is absolutely to whether a mentally unstable person should be able to buy guns is ridiculous. Let's do a little history lesson here.

If a president (let's say Reagan) cuts the budget for mental institutions, and someone is out of the mental institution (because of Reagan), they can go out and buy a gun under your beautiful little world. So under by your argument, we need a police state to make sure everyone in the country is mentally sane, not a criminal (I'm assuming that if they've served their time it's okay), and not an illegal alien (don't know how this fits in except in order to make a xenophobic reference,) then everyone can have guns.

How pray tell do we get to the police state where people like that don't have guns without turning our country into Iraq. Even better, Iraq isn't a good example, cause it's never been done. How do we get to that police state?

[gopjoke]

The kid who shot up his classmates and teachers in Arkansas was exposed to guns at a very young age.
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[onlyalad]

Now see I don't necessarily have something inherently with guns, (I've shot them when I was you and in the boys scouts, and more recently). But at the end of the day I don't see how people like NRA member could possibly think that regulation is nuts, and how they need AK-47's.

[NRA Member]

onlyalad,
I am a law-abiding citizen of the United States. With that being said, any law-abiding citizen does not need(or will accept) you or anyone else dictating to them what they do or do not need.
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[ON TARGET]

NRA, you sound like one of hitler's programmed soldiers. look at what you wrote. you really do sound like you're totally programmed.
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[Levittown Cowboy]

right on target!..This NRA guy sounds like he'll be burning cosses on lawns soon.

[NRA Member]

Gentlemen,
You are deviating from the topic of guns. You of course have the right to say as you wish. So do I. With that being said let me say sincerely that, "I don't give a dam what you think."
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[ON TARGET]

he gets a little crazy when you start to mention things like the fact that the 2nd amendment only calls for the right to bear arms for a "well regulated militia"..NRA doesn't like the truth....
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[BOOCHEE]

WE DID ACCEPT IT STUPID, ITS THE LAW. AND WE ALWAYS OBEY THE LAW.EVEN IF WE DO NOT AGREE WITH IT.

[NRA Member]

On target, Eat @#%$, are you as ugly as you are dumb when it comes to the second amendment? over 38 states have adapeted and put into there constitutions citizens right to carry firearms laws.
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[Long Time Gun Owner]

I have owned all types of firearms for over 30 years. I've been a competition pistol and rifle shooter for 20 years. Am I an NRA member? NO F'ING WAY. Should anyone be allowed to own a gun? See my response to my NRA affiliation. Bottom line, MOST guns are designed to kill something, PERIOD. Firearm ownership carries with it a tremendous responsiblity to ensure not only the shooter's safety, but the safety of anyone who may be around a firearm. Do I have a right to own a machine gun? Only in the NRA's convoluted dream world. I won't get into 2A arguments with extremists, from either side of the debate. The facts are: The Federal Government and the States DO have the authority to regulate gun ownership by private citizens. If the NRA wants to actually do something to further the interests of legal gun owners, start policing yourselves. Turn in the FFL holders that are making straw sales. Those FFL holders are the single largest source of illegal firearms on the streets today. Stop trying to circumvent the law with modifications to your own firearms. Demand extremely strict penalties for illegal posession of a firearm, and demand that they be enforced. If you live in an area where a permit is required, and you own a gun without a permit, then you are NOT an honest citizen. You ARE a criminal, and should be prosecuted. The more you scream for unrestricted gun ownership, the more the other side will fight you. And guess what? The other side is winning. Time to find a new strategy.

[Long Time Gun Owner]

NRA Aholes

[NRA]

You can only wish you were Charlton Heston, at best you a mixed up confused bag of @#%$

[charlton heston]

More class from the NRA.

[NRA and proud of it]

You must be one of those MCCarthy Lacky's

[charlton heston]

Not one of her lacky's. You must very frustrated that in a highly Republican district she kicks your butts time and time again. Maybe it's because people agree with her?

[rantnrave]

Why would Rep. McCarthy want to repeal the 2nd amendment? It's stupid. I personally own several guns. and know how to and now to use them. Just per say: someone breaks into your house with a knife or bat... What are you gonna do call the cops and throw pillows at them till they leave and the police show up a half hour later. I know i sure as hell wouldn't. because I own and use firearms they'd be shot. It's self defense and the defending of personal property and family members. all of which garunteed to us in the constitution. The peaple out there saying"Guns Kill People, Not People". well what about all the stabbings, rapes, drownings, and things of such? they're idiots. People KIll People.

[looker]

There are too many politicos trying to change the constitution with subtractions and additions. It has worked for 200 plus years. Its mad.
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