why cant you join 2 vol fd dept in ny state?

[oneday]

does any one know why you cant join more then one vol fire dept in ny state? yet you can join more then one vol ems places is there a reason for this? and why dont vol ems places offer a penchin?

[Unregisteredr6ur4uew]

does any one know why you cant join more then one vol fire dept in ny state? yet you can join more then one vol ems places is there a reason for this? and why dont vol ems places offer a penchin?


WTF is a PENCHIN?

[pentane]

um maybe it's pentane
for answer to what you asked i think its becouse incase you get hurt while on a firer job you go out on worker comp if your in more then one dept i think it becouses a money problem who covers you but in same respect you have alot of city guys who are city firer fighters and vol so who knows what the real answer is

[Unregistered45896]

The law was changed............. you can joint two departments, you just can't collect pensions from both.

[ineedmyspace]

thank you for the info it seems not to many people know the law.

so you can vol in the town you live in and the town you work in and it should be no problem
do dept in suffolk county lety ou do that?

[stfd]

i think you have go have your cheif sign off on it and have the other dept sign off on it and you should be fine but check with your rec dept
your people in dept mite not like it

[statledmek]

The law as I read it is pretty clear. You must reside in the fire district you volunteer in. The only places that have the ability to take non residents are on Fire Island. Ambulance Corps can take in outsiders but they are not fire departments. The law says you can NOT collect 2 LOSAPs.

If someone thinks that has changed please post what you see.

[Unregistered4654465]

It HAS changed...... I will try to find and post it....... And correct as I previous said you can not collect twice.............

[chairmanbillyboy]

The law as I read it is pretty clear. You must reside in the fire district you volunteer in. The only places that have the ability to take non residents are on Fire Island. Ambulance Corps can take in outsiders but they are not fire departments. The law says you can NOT collect 2 LOSAPs.

If someone thinks that has changed please post what you see.

can not collect 2 losap awards but many departments allow people outside their district to join. our district allows withing 3 miles of the district border.

[Unregistered458965]

HERE IT IS........................

Section 1. The general municipal law is amended by adding a new section 209-k to read as follows:


S 209-K. VOLUNTEERING OF SERVICES TO ADDITIONAL FIRE COMPANIES. A VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTER SHALL NOT BE PROHIBITED BY A FIRE COMPANY FROM VOLUNTEERING HIS OR HER SERVICES TO OTHER FIRE COMPANIES OUTSIDE OF THE AREA IN WHICH HE OR SHE REGULARLY SERVES.

[Unregistered 4564654564]

Here is the rest of it............

S 2. Subdivision 10 of section 176-b of the town law, as added by chapter 699 of the laws of 1954, is amended to read as follows:
10. A person shall be eligible to volunteer membership in more than one fire company at one time.

S 3. Subdivision 10 of section 10-1006 of the village law is amended to read as follows:
10. A person shall be eligible to volunteer membership in more than one fire company at one time.

S 4. Subdivision 10 of section 16-a of the general city law, as added by chapter 699 of the laws of 1954, is amended to read as follows:
10. A person shall be eligible to volunteer membership in more than one fire company at one time.

Section 30 of the volunteer firefighters' benefit law is amended by adding a new subdivision 13 to read as follows:

13. A. NOTWITHSTANDING ANY OTHER PROVISION OF LAW TO THE CONTRARY, IF DEATH OR INJURY RESULTS FROM THE PERFORMANCE OF DUTY WHERE A VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTER IS A MEMBER OF MORE THAN ONE FIRE COMPANY PERMITTED UNDER SECTION TWO HUNDRED NINE-K OF THE GENERAL MUNICIPAL LAW, SUBDIVISION TEN OF SECTION ONE HUNDRED SEVENTY-SIX-B OF THE TOWN LAW, SUBDIVISION TEN OF SECTION 10-1006 OF THE VILLAGE LAW, SUBDIVISION TEN OF SECTION 16-A OF THE GENERAL CITY LAW OR THE FIRE COMPANY FOR WHOM THE VOLUNTEER FIRE FIGHTER WAS ASSISTING WHILE SUCH INJURY OCCURRED SHALL BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE PROVISION OF BENEFITS TO THE VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTER, B. NO MULTI-MEMBER VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTER SHALL RECEIVE ADDITIONAL BENEFITS AS A RESULT OF HIS OR HER MEMBERSHIP IN ADDITIONAL FIRE DEPART MENTS.

[Unregistered0754]

hi thank you all for your help
to be honest i really didint even thing about the LOSAPs i dont even know how it works i just became a voli i was asking becouse i work in nassua and i live in suffolk i want to know if i can vol in the town i work.
in my dept i was told it gos by who you ask and more then the law poltics plays in to it. so i was wondering what the law was

so i can join if both dept let just cant collect from both only the town i live in.

thank you all for your help

[UnregisteredPenchin]

WTF is a PENCHIN?

I have a penchin for young girls well developed.

[X 30]

As always, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing and the internet is a continued source of misinformation.
The various amendments to the General Municipal Law, Town Law, Village Law and VFBL mentioned in previous posts are only proposed changes and are set forth in Assembly Bill A09216 which was introduced on October 28, 2009 and referred to the Local Government Committee. A09216 was again referred to Local Government on January 6, 2010, but no action has been taken on it to date. This Assembly Bill does not have a companion piece in the Senate so chances for enactment at this point appear slim.
In summary, New York State law has not been changed and the long standing prohibitions barring an individual from membership in more than one fire company still stand. Most of the opposition to passage of the proposed legislation seems to come from uninformed fire districts who are concered about their perceived increased liabilities and until they change their position this is a dead issue.

[Unregistered22222]

so whats the answer since every one is just copying and pasting laws\rules can i join a dept were i work or will they luagh at me and its a no?




HERE IT IS........................

Section 1. The general municipal law is amended by adding a new section 209-k to read as follows:


S 209-K. VOLUNTEERING OF SERVICES TO ADDITIONAL FIRE COMPANIES. A VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTER SHALL NOT BE PROHIBITED BY A FIRE COMPANY FROM VOLUNTEERING HIS OR HER SERVICES TO OTHER FIRE COMPANIES OUTSIDE OF THE AREA IN WHICH HE OR SHE REGULARLY SERVES.

[umdontgetit]

so why can fdny guys join a vol if there worrie about guys getting hurt? and why can you join 2 ems voli? plenty of emt\medics hurt there back or get hurt doing some thing and yet there plenty of guys who join 2,3 dept of ems
why is there a double standerd?
can some one be a firerfighter of a voll in ny state and for exple in nj? if they have 2 houses?

[X 30]

In summary, New York State law has not been changed and the long standing prohibitions barring an individual from membership in more than one fire company still stand.

If you can't understand this and as I suspect from your spelling and use of grammar, you can't, there is little point in explaining further but I will try.

You can not be a member of more than one volunteer fire department in New York State. According to law, you may be a volunteer firefighter and a career firefighter in New York at the same time. You may also be a volunteer firefighter and a volunteer ambulance member at the same time, but you can not belong to more than one volunteer fire company or department. There is no prohibition against being a volunteer member in New York and being a volunteer member in another state - the prohibition extends only to activities within New York State.

[Unregistered44565]

x30 I believe you are wrong and this was adopted late last year.........

[A09216]

x30 is correct. The bill is still held up in the Assembly, and no recent action has been taken. You can see for yourself on the NYS Assembly website.

[Unregistered1234321]

so why can fdny guys join a vol if there worrie about guys getting hurt? and why can you join 2 ems voli? plenty of emt\medics hurt there back or get hurt doing some thing and yet there plenty of guys who join 2,3 dept of ems
why is there a double standerd?
can some one be a firerfighter of a voll in ny state and for exple in nj? if they have 2 houses?

no. that is a different state, with different protocols. You would probably need the states basic fire courses(ex: suffolk you need firefighter 1, not sure if thats nationally recognized

[Unregistered99999999]

You can provide service to a fire dept where you work or are regularly in district on an "On-Going" basis under section 209-i of the NYS general municipal law. However the decision to accept ongoing service is up to the Chief and / or commissioners of the accepting dept.

[Unregistered99999999999]

NY is the only state in the country that prohibits membership in more than 1 fire dept. , You can join as many volunteer EMS agencies as you are able and you can get more than 1 LOSAP as long as you are able to make the activity, You can also get 2 LOSAP awards by joining a Fire Dept and a vol. EMS agency and making the activity in each, you just can't do 2 fire depts. under current state law. There are hundreds of FD and and EMS personnel in NY collecting 2 LOSAPS this way. Right now the NYS association of Fire Districts opposes A9216 so it probably won't pass. A similar bill A9542 and S6066 passed both the Assembly and Senate in 2008 but were vetoed by Governor Patterson at the urging of the Fire Districts association (Veto Message 43 of 2008) If you would like to see A9216 pass contact your state Senator and ask them to sponsor a senate version of the bill.

[Unregistered9999999999]

A NYS Comptrollers opinion regarding service by volunteer firefighters from outside of NYS:
Opinion 2000 - 15

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This opinion represents the views of the Office of the State Comptroller at the time it was rendered. The opinion may no longer represent those views if, among other things, there have been subsequent court cases or statutory amendments that bear on the issues discussed in the opinion.


VOLUNTEER FIREFIGHTERS - Eligibility (of out-of-state firefighter to volunteer on on-going basis)

GENERAL MUNICIPAL LAW §§209-i, 462: A volunteer firefighter from an out-of-state fire company may not volunteer to assist a fire district fire department within New York State on an on-going basis pursuant to General Municipal Law §209-i.

You ask whether a volunteer firefighter who resides in another state and is a member of an out-of-state volunteer fire department may volunteer his or her services on an on-going basis to a New York State fire district fire department.

General Municipal Law §209-i (1-a) provides in relevant part that a "volunteer firefighter" 1 who, because of his or her residence or usual occupation, is regularly in the area served by a volunteer fire company or department of which he or she is not a member, may volunteer his or her services on an on-going basis to the officer in command of the company or department to assist the company's or department's general or emergency ambulance services, or to assist at a fire or other emergency scene. The commanding officer of a fire district fire department, when authorized by the board of the fire commissioners, is empowered, in his or her discretion, to so accept the services of such a volunteer firefighter. Section 209-i(1-a) further provides that a volunteer firefighter whose services are accepted by the commanding officer of a fire district fire department under that section is entitled to all powers, rights, privileges and immunities granted by law to the volunteer members of the fire department during the time services are rendered, including benefits under the Volunteer Firefighters' Benefit Law ("VFBL"), in the same manner and to the same extent as if he or she were a member of the fire department.

For purposes of section 209-i, a volunteer firefighter means a "volunteer firefighter as such term is defined in section three of the volunteer firefighters' benefit law" (General Municipal Law §209-i [3]). VFBL §3(1) defines "volunteer firefighter" to mean an active volunteer member of a "fire company". "Fire company", in turn, is defined to mean: a fire company of a "county, city, town, village or fire district" fire department, whether or not incorporated under "general or special law"; certain fire corporations incorporated under or subject to the provisions of the "Not-For-Profit Corporation Law"; and certain fire corporations incorporated under or established pursuant to the provisions of any "general or special law" (VFBL §3[2]). In our opinion, the references to counties, towns, cities, villages and fire districts, and to New York State laws (see Municipal Home Rule Law §2[5], [12]) indicate that these definitions in VFBL §3(1) relate only to volunteer firefighters of fire departments and companies within the State of New York. Accordingly, we conclude that a volunteer firefighter from an out-of-state fire company may not volunteer to assist a fire district fire department within New York State on an on-going basis pursuant to General Municipal Law §209-i (cf. Volunteer Firefighters' Benefit Law §21[2], relative to calls for assistance by volunteer firefighters of fire departments and fire companies of other states and Canada who render service in New York State).

As an alternative, the fire district may wish to consider the provisions of article 14-G of the General Municipal Law (§460 et seq.). That article authorizes, inter alia, New York State fire districts to enter into interlocal agreements with any local governmental unit, subdivision or special district of another State, providing for the furnishing by one of the contracting entities to the other of personnel, facilities, equipment or any other property or resources for fire-fighting (General Municipal Law §§461[1], 462[1][a][1]). The interlocal agreement must be authorized by the board of fire commissioners of the fire district, is subject to a public hearing (General Municipal Law §463; Town Law §176[22]) and must contain provisions addressing certain specific matters (General Municipal Law §466). The agreement is subject to the approval of the New York State Attorney General (General Municipal Law §469) and the fire district must render a report concerning the transactions, operations and activities entered into, performed or conducted under the agreement to the State Comptroller (General Municipal Law §470). Pursuant to this authority, it may be possible that the fire district may enter into an agreement with the local governmental entity, subdivision or special district, if any, with which an out-of-state firefighter is affiliated, for the services of this firefighter, if such an agreement is permissible under the laws of the other state (see 1964 Atty Gen [Inf Opns] p 84). In view of the Attorney General's approval role under article 14-G, you may wish to contact the Attorney General concerning the applicability of these provisions.2

October 2, 2000
Daniel Doran, Esq., Counsel
New Castle Fire District No. 1

1 Although section 209-i uses the term "volunteer fireman", this term is deemed to mean "volunteer firefighter" (see General Municipal Law §209-c[3]; Volunteer Firefighters' Benefit Law §§3[1], 1[b]).

2 Questions concerning VFBL coverage for firefighters providing service under any such contracts as may be authorized under article 14-G should be addressed to the Workers' Compensation Board (see VFBL §43; 1987 Opns St Comp No. 87-57, p 87).

[Unregistereda9216]

There is presently legislation in Albany to change the law in regard to allowing volunteer firefighters to volunteer for more than one department. Under present NYS law, it is illegal to be a member of more than one department.

Essentially, you can be a member of on fire department and as many volunteer ambulance corps as you like or you can be a paid firefighter in multiple departments but NYS law prohibits you from doing it for free. This legislation would correct this situation. It would give volunteers who have second residences or vacation homes or are college students the opportunity to serve in departments in those communities. Additionally, many departments have ex-chiefs and life members that relocate and are forced to give up their membership in their former department in order to volunteer in their new community.

There is a section of the NYS general municipal law that allows for ongoing service by volunteer firefighters in multiple departments but it is not embraced by fire districts as it does not address VFBL, as well as other issues. It also goes against NIMS and NRF principles based on identification and credential issues of emergency responders. An incident commander would have to seriously consider the consequences of allowing someone to operate at an incident if they were unaware of their training, affiliations or medical status. The liability incurred would be a disaster should that person be injured or their actions causing injuries to another party.

The legislation to correct this situation is Assembly Bill A9542 and Senate Bill S6690, introduced by Assemblywoman Ginny Fields and Senator Caesar Trunzo and co-sponsored by Assembly members DelMonte, Koon, Gabryazak, Carrozza, Seminerio, Boyland, Brook-Krasny, Crouch, Eddington, D. Gordon, Kolb, Magee, McEneny, Reilly, Schimel, Sweeney, Weisenberg, Young and Senators LaValle, Bonacic and Flanagan. Both bills have also received support from many fire service agencies including FASNY and the NYS Association of Fire Chiefs as well as local organizations and chief’s councils.

The legislation would create a new section of the General Municipal law and would state: “No fire company serving a city, county, town or village shall prohibit a volunteer firefighter from volunteering his or her services to other fire companies outside the area in which he or she regularly serves.”

Both bills were approved by the local government committee of the Assembly and Senate. The Assembly bill is presently in the Assembly Ways and Means Committee and the Senate bill was placed on the Senate calendar for a vote by the full Senate in the upcoming weeks. If the bills are approved, they could become laws this summer.

In a time where almost every firehouse has a sign outside that reads “Volunteers Needed,” the new bill is a great way to instantly boost manpower at little or no additional cost to taxpayers as these firefighters would be available immediately with their training already paid for. In many cases, they can bring valuable experience and practices to their new department and vice versa. The bill also improves accountability and reduces liability as any department accepting firefighter will now have OSHA physical results and training records for that member. The legislation will benefit departments throughout New York State but will especially help small seasonal departments such as those on Fire Island, the east end of Long Island and areas of upstate that have large vacation populations as well as towns with colleges and universities.

The concept of this legislation was put together by concerned local firefighters who felt that legislation such as this would benefit firefighters throughout the state. They urge all firefighters to contact their local Assembly members and Senators to urge them to support the legislation. More information can be found at www.assembly.state.ny.us or www.senate.state.ny.us