School taxes in half

[Unregistered4574657467]

Recently a friend of mine saw a beautifull house for sale on the water, the price was right and he ran right down to see it . The house he said was in really good shape. The he found out that the house, even though in Massapeuqa was in the Amityville school district. It comes down in many ways to the chicken or the egg. People complain about high school taxes, but its those very schools that drive their home values. If we where to say, cut teachers pay in half and drasticly reduce school funding how long to do you think it would take for your home value to drop? Theres a reason a house of the same size shape and condition is far more money in one town then in another.

[Unschool]

Recently a friend of mine saw a beautifull house for sale on the water, the price was right and he ran right down to see it . The house he said was in really good shape. The he found out that the house, even though in Massapeuqa was in the Amityville school district. It comes down in many ways to the chicken or the egg. People complain about high school taxes, but its those very schools that drive their home values. If we where to say, cut teachers pay in half and drasticly reduce school funding how long to do you think it would take for your home value to drop? Theres a reason a house of the same size shape and condition is far more money in one town then in another.

But let's face it, there's a lot you can cut in any district, whether it's Hempstead or Roslyn.

[Unreg01]

It's not just teacher's salaries that make school taxes high even though it is a big part. The real problem is the pensions and health care costs, of which teachers pay way less than an average private sector employee. Until we focus on controlling those two areas of large expense, taxes will continue to increase.

Here is what we need to do:

1- opt out of the pension system for all new hires, while this won't save us money in the short run in the long run it will. For the current employees there would be no change. We need to create a 401K style retirement fund for the teachers where the district will match their contributions to their retirement plan. Few private sector employees still have pensions, we all have 401k's. By matching the teachers contributions, the local districts will not have to make up large shortfalls in the pension fund if the stock market goes south. The teacher's will lose money, like all of us do. Why should they be get a guaranteed pension, why should the taxpayer bail out the teachers while the rest of the community is struggling.

2- Make teachers pay what private sector employees pay for their health coverage, I believe the average is 30%. No more sweetheart deals! Teachers should pay their fair share. Any teacher who says that they are already paying their fare share should look at what us private sector employees pay before commenting.

If we tackled these two issues of health care and pensions, by implementing my suggested changes, ONLY then will we the overtaxed tax payer see real property tax relief.

[Unregistered gUEST]

It's not just teacher's salaries that make school taxes high even though it is a big part. The real problem is the pensions and health care costs, of which teachers pay way less than an average private sector employee. Until we focus on controlling those two areas of large expense, taxes will continue to increase.

Here is what we need to do:

1- opt out of the pension system for all new hires, while this won't save us money in the short run in the long run it will. For the current employees there would be no change. We need to create a 401K style retirement fund for the teachers where the district will match their contributions to their retirement plan. Few private sector employees still have pensions, we all have 401k's. By matching the teachers contributions, the local districts will not have to make up large shortfalls in the pension fund if the stock market goes south. The teacher's will lose money, like all of us do. Why should they be get a guaranteed pension, why should the taxpayer bail out the teachers while the rest of the community is struggling.

2- Make teachers pay what private sector employees pay for their health coverage, I believe the average is 30%. No more sweetheart deals! Teachers should pay their fair share. Any teacher who says that they are already paying their fare share should look at what us private sector employees pay before commenting.

If we tackled these two issues of health care and pensions, by implementing my suggested changes, ONLY then will we the overtaxed tax payer see real property tax relief.

Over 60% of the cost of a Teacher is salary! So salary is the major problem!

Pension costs are directly related to the Teacher's salary.

Health Benefits have increased greatly in the last 10 years, but our new President is fixing Health Care.

All these issues would have to be negotciated with the Teachers Union. Look at the way they treat the Children in the Old Bethpage/Plainview Schools. Wearing BLACK because they are working without a contract! Refusing to write College Reccomendations for Students. Refusing to post the Childrens work on class room walls.

Drive past your local School, check what type of cars the Teachers drive? Is it nicer than yours? They work 180 days a year, how many do You work? They work 6 hours a day including lunch, how many do You work?

They have a great JOB and they don't care about anyone but themselves. Lets ask the how do we spell RECESSION! They demand 4% - 6% raises plus their salary step which averages another 3%.

[Good post...]

Over 60% of the cost of a Teacher is salary! So salary is the major problem!

Pension costs are directly related to the Teacher's salary.

Health Benefits have increased greatly in the last 10 years, but our new President is fixing Health Care.

All these issues would have to be negotciated with the Teachers Union. Look at the way they treat the Children in the Old Bethpage/Plainview Schools. Wearing BLACK because they are working without a contract! Refusing to write College Reccomendations for Students. Refusing to post the Childrens work on class room walls.

Drive past your local School, check what type of cars the Teachers drive? Is it nicer than yours? They work 180 days a year, how many do You work? They work 6 hours a day including lunch, how many do You work?

They have a great JOB and they don't care about anyone but themselves. Lets ask the how do we spell RECESSION! They demand 4% - 6% raises plus their salary step which averages another 3%.

I particularly agree with your point about the step increases. They should be eliminated right now. What value does a teacher add to the classroom by getting a master's plus 60 credits? Isn't that overkill? Is it any more value than a master's plus 30? And let's face it, a teacher can get a master's plus 30 or 60 and still suck. It's more about the attitude and approach they bring to the classroom.

The other thing to eliminate is longevity pay. Are they kidding??? They get tenure AND longevity pay? Why do they need both? But I put the blame on the school boards with no 'nads who negotiated these awful contracts. Once you hear a school board member say "It's all about the children", you know they are going to give the teachers whatever they want. Email them and let them know how you feel.

[Unregistered Guest]

I particularly agree with your point about the step increases. They should be eliminated right now. What value does a teacher add to the classroom by getting a master's plus 60 credits? Isn't that overkill? Is it any more value than a master's plus 30? And let's face it, a teacher can get a master's plus 30 or 60 and still suck. It's more about the attitude and approach they bring to the classroom.

The other thing to eliminate is longevity pay. Are they kidding??? They get tenure AND longevity pay? Why do they need both? But I put the blame on the school boards with no 'nads who negotiated these awful contracts. Once you hear a school board member say "It's all about the children", you know they are going to give the teachers whatever they want. Email them and let them know how you feel.

You're correct, I didn't even think of Longevity pay on top of the Yearly Steps they receive. When is enough? The way they Blackmail the Students and Parents really bugs Me.

[Unregistered4434]

But let's face it, there's a lot you can cut in any district, whether it's Hempstead or Roslyn.

Theres a lot you can cut in almost every private corporation as well. The top of the food chainis always insulated and makes sure its okay and thriving. YOu think a bunch of guys who ran the bankingindustry into the ground deserved multi million dollar bonuses ? Yet both Bush a Rep and Obama a Dem each gave them a ton of bailout money, and Mcain was for it as well

[Unregistered Guest]

We can fight for change locally, Washington SUCKS! But the School Budgets are a few thousand Votes. People are loosing their jobs and homes, when do we fight back?

Taking control of the School Board is step ONE. Step two, firing the School Superintendent. Three, hiring new Lawyers and Accountant. Four, reducing Deputy and Assistant Superintendents to ONE or NONE. Same with Principals, Asst. Principals, Department Heads, Deans of Discipline, and all the other jobs created over the last thirty years.

Then the Teachers, lengthen their day to 8 hours, unpaid period for lunch. 180 odd days is the minimium, why not 200 days of School? Salaries must be cut, they are extreme in this economy! The benefit packages have to be adjusted to reflect the reality of today. They have to pay a pct. of their benefits and any increased costs. Severance Packages are also too costly and are hidden in the Capital Budget so Taxpayers don't know the true cost.

If the Union refuses to accept cuts, don't settle the Contract. That freezes their Salaries and allows certain changes! If they refuse to preform their duties,(like Plainview/Old Bethpage) fire them! Enough is enough, we have to fight back.

[Unregistered453]

We can fight for change locally, Washington SUCKS! But the School Budgets are a few thousand Votes. People are loosing their jobs and homes, when do we fight back?

Recenly me wife and I looked into moving. Our biggest hurdle was finding good schools out of state. Guess what, they where far and few between, and we did find a good one, the houses and taxes where comparable to here. The parents of kids in your district dont want to see it destroyed, altered sure, but in my district we like the SUperintendant. WHile I think they are too top heavy, I dont want to see everyone fired. We like in a supply and demand economy. YOur house is worth what it is , one reason is the excellent school districts. Theres a reason a huge new house down South costs so little. If there was a better place to go people would be flocking there. Long Island costs what it costs because thats what living on Long Island is worth

Taking control of the School Board is step ONE. Step two, firing the School Superintendent. Three, hiring new Lawyers and Accountant. Four, reducing Deputy and Assistant Superintendents to ONE or NONE. Same with Principals, Asst. Principals, Department Heads, Deans of Discipline, and all the other jobs created over the last thirty years.

Then the Teachers, lengthen their day to 8 hours, unpaid period for lunch. 180 odd days is the minimium, why not 200 days of School? Salaries must be cut, they are extreme in this economy!

People take civil service jobs for security. When everyone in the private sector is making money hand over fist they could care less. When times get tough they want civil service employees raped. Im not a teacher, I worked for the COunty. Our last contract started out before the housing market fell out and the COunty had a surplass. Year one, a big fat zero. Civil servants tend to get 3% across the board in good times and in bad.

The benefit packages have to be adjusted to reflect the reality of today. They have to pay a pct. of their benefits and any increased costs. Severance Packages are also too costly and are hidden in the Capital Budget so Taxpayers don't know the true cost.

I cant tell you how many times ive gotten calls from my kids teachers at night. My sons in 1st grade, if he forgets his homework I e mail his teacher and generaly within an hour I get it sent to me. Grading papers and such are done after hours. I dont believe teachers dont average 8 hours a day. The school year is a diffrent argument

If the Union refuses to accept cuts, don't settle the Contract. That freezes their Salaries and allows certain changes! If they refuse to preform their duties,(like Plainview/Old Bethpage) fire them! Enough is enough, we have to fight back.


Then they will go to fact finding, the Union has certain rights beacuse they arent allowed to strike. Feel free to fire as many as you want, when five years from a now NYS Supreme Court orders them re instated with all back pay youll have paid for them and their replacement.

I agree we need to see downsizing of these top heavy positions. I also think public employees need to pay more into their pensions, the employer less. Health benefits are out of control, insurance companies are making millions and stuffing Washingtons pockets. WHat we should do is fix healthcare period

[987987987]

It's not just teacher's salaries that make school taxes high even though it is a big part. The real problem is the pensions and health care costs, of which teachers pay way less than an average private sector employee. Until we focus on controlling those two areas of large expense, taxes will continue to increase.

Here is what we need to do:

1- opt out of the pension system for all new hires, while this won't save us money in the short run in the long run it will. For the current employees there would be no change. We need to create a 401K style retirement fund for the teachers where the district will match their contributions to their retirement plan. Few private sector employees still have pensions, we all have 401k's. By matching the teachers contributions, the local districts will not have to make up large shortfalls in the pension fund if the stock market goes south. The teacher's will lose money, like all of us do. Why should they be get a guaranteed pension, why should the taxpayer bail out the teachers while the rest of the community is struggling.

2- Make teachers pay what private sector employees pay for their health coverage, I believe the average is 30%. No more sweetheart deals! Teachers should pay their fair share. Any teacher who says that they are already paying their fare share should look at what us private sector employees pay before commenting.

If we tackled these two issues of health care and pensions, by implementing my suggested changes, ONLY then will we the overtaxed tax payer see real property tax relief.

The only thing wrong with the pension system, is that after 10 years you stop paying into it, (I'm not aware the teachers have any different plan than CSEA). The pension is not free. I don't know why having a pension angers people so much. Some private companies still have a pension plan too. The only problem with it ---- when people became so disposable, they couldn't count on staying enough years with a company to collect. I had worked in a private sector company where I saw a hardworking, loyal employee fired 10 days before she was eligible to vest her pension. For no reason either. They just claimed "cuts." What needs to be changed in the private sector is "at will employment."

Do you also feel we should do away with the Social Security System??? That was a pension plan too. Its grown to include many other things, but that's government for you.

What you overlooked as a benefit to overtaxed taxpayers, is the top heavy administration and corruption. The corruption also extends to allowing non-taxpayers to use our schools. You should have to bring your tax bill to register for school, and to vote on the school budget. Stop blaming hardworking teachers for our property tax problem.

[Unregistered46466]

Do you also feel we should do away with the Social Security System??? That was a pension plan too. Its grown to include many other things, but that's government for you.


Wha wha what ? Give away my SS pension ? Hell no. I just want to get rid of other peoples pensions to save myself money. The fact that FICA is expensive as well is okay beacuse I get something out of that.


My favorite is people who want medicare but argue that a Gov health plan is unconstitutional, Socialistic and wrong.


WHen times where good you couldnt get people to be a jail guard, the blew through every list and where desperate for people. Then when things get tight everyone cries that those jail guards make to much. Take the test, there still having problems getting people to take the job. Of course most people wouldnt work in those conditions themselves, they just want to bitch about those who are actualy willing to do it

[u r the problem]

The only thing wrong with the pension system, is that after 10 years you stop paying into it, (I'm not aware the teachers have any different plan than CSEA). The pension is not free. I don't know why having a pension angers people so much. Some private companies still have a pension plan too. The only problem with it ---- when people became so disposable, they couldn't count on staying enough years with a company to collect. I had worked in a private sector company where I saw a hardworking, loyal employee fired 10 days before she was eligible to vest her pension. For no reason either. They just claimed "cuts." What needs to be changed in the private sector is "at will employment."

Do you also feel we should do away with the Social Security System??? That was a pension plan too. Its grown to include many other things, but that's government for you.

What you overlooked as a benefit to overtaxed taxpayers, is the top heavy administration and corruption. The corruption also extends to allowing non-taxpayers to use our schools. You should have to bring your tax bill to register for school, and to vote on the school budget. Stop blaming hardworking teachers for our property tax problem.

You mean greedy teachers. Sorry pal, but teacher pay makes up 70% of my district's budget. START THE CUTTING RIGHT THERE. Let me tell you, if the teachers in my district were fired, those positions would be filled right away. YOU SIMPLY DON'T KNOW WHEN YOU HAVE IT GOOD. Learn to sacrifice, like the rest of us. Until then, just STFU. If you don't like it, drive a cab for a living. The public has had it with your selfishness.

[Unregistered43433443]

You mean greedy teachers. Sorry pal, but teacher pay makes up 70% of my district's budget. START THE CUTTING RIGHT THERE. Let me tell you, if the teachers in my district were fired, those positions would be filled right away. YOU SIMPLY DON'T KNOW WHEN YOU HAVE IT GOOD. Learn to sacrifice, like the rest of us. Until then, just STFU. If you don't like it, drive a cab for a living. The public has had it with your selfishness.

Im not a teacher an I totaly dont agree with you. But tell me , 5 years ago was the rest of the Country sacraficing? Too much of people arguments are based on selfish self intrest. Long ISland schools are one of the major factors driving the high value of home prices here. I love my kids school, Ive loved all their teachers. I think my district can cut some fat, but so can virtualy every company private or public in the County. MAybe your sacraficing becasue you you used your homes equity like a piggy bank, or maybe you made so much money that when things got rough in the private sector you got cut. ironic then you want the same thing done to others. WHen times are tough you want EVRYONE to sacrafice, but Id bet your the first to say your not a SOcialist. Heres one for you STFU, if you cant afford it here in one of the best places to live in America too bad, MOVE. Maybe you should drive a cab for extra money. or gotten a better education or job. MAybe you should have been teacher. If idiots like you had there way the schools would me gutted and then in 10 years youd sit their enraged that the price of your home fell 25% becasue the schools where shit. YOu get what you pay for, we pay a lot for schools, we get great schools. Stop payinghigh taxesin Nassau and watch how fast it becomes a shithole exstention of the CIty

[987987987]

I'm not a teacher. Perhaps your teacher didn't do such a good job, because I stated I am a CSEA worker. I don't know any "RICH" teachers either. The teachers I know work hard all year round, and bring home work with them at night. They spend alot of their own money on the children because supplies they need are not in the budget. They are paying back huge student loans. While I don't agree that this last contract should have seen large increases every year for 5 years, when other unions have had to take cuts and givebacks, and private sector lost lots of jobs, and many have not had raises either, I don't think they make the high salaries you seem to think. Again, I think alot of this problem is overcrowding because of illegal apartments, and too many administrators. What do you think is a fair salary for a teacher at start, and 5, 10, 15... years?

[you're wrong]

Im not a teacher an I totaly dont agree with you. But tell me , 5 years ago was the rest of the Country sacraficing? Too much of people arguments are based on selfish self intrest. Long ISland schools are one of the major factors driving the high value of home prices here. I love my kids school, Ive loved all their teachers. I think my district can cut some fat, but so can virtualy every company private or public in the County. MAybe your sacraficing becasue you you used your homes equity like a piggy bank, or maybe you made so much money that when things got rough in the private sector you got cut. ironic then you want the same thing done to others. WHen times are tough you want EVRYONE to sacrafice, but Id bet your the first to say your not a SOcialist. Heres one for you STFU, if you cant afford it here in one of the best places to live in America too bad, MOVE. Maybe you should drive a cab for extra money. or gotten a better education or job. MAybe you should have been teacher. If idiots like you had there way the schools would me gutted and then in 10 years youd sit their enraged that the price of your home fell 25% becasue the schools where shit. YOu get what you pay for, we pay a lot for schools, we get great schools. Stop payinghigh taxesin Nassau and watch how fast it becomes a shithole exstention of the CIty

I CAN afford to live here, I DID NOT tap into my home's equity, and I DID NOT get cut. That being said, in case you live in a cave, the fact is that when school taxes go up, ESPECIALLY when it outpaces inflation the way it has, something in the household budget gets less. Now, I'm glad that you're so f*cking rich that this escapes you, but there are middle class people out there like me who feel it when school taxes double in 6 years, yet we see no improvement in school performance. Now how can you justify paying double for something yet seeing no improvement???? And most of it goes to the teachers' salaries.

[are you ignorant?]

Im not a teacher an I totaly dont agree with you. But tell me , 5 years ago was the rest of the Country sacraficing? Too much of people arguments are based on selfish self intrest. Long ISland schools are one of the major factors driving the high value of home prices here. I love my kids school, Ive loved all their teachers. I think my district can cut some fat, but so can virtualy every company private or public in the County. MAybe your sacraficing becasue you you used your homes equity like a piggy bank, or maybe you made so much money that when things got rough in the private sector you got cut. ironic then you want the same thing done to others. WHen times are tough you want EVRYONE to sacrafice, but Id bet your the first to say your not a SOcialist. Heres one for you STFU, if you cant afford it here in one of the best places to live in America too bad, MOVE. Maybe you should drive a cab for extra money. or gotten a better education or job. MAybe you should have been teacher. If idiots like you had there way the schools would me gutted and then in 10 years youd sit their enraged that the price of your home fell 25% becasue the schools where shit. YOu get what you pay for, we pay a lot for schools, we get great schools. Stop payinghigh taxesin Nassau and watch how fast it becomes a shithole exstention of the CIty

At a time when people are losing jobs, going into foreclosure, getting no salary increases, etc. how can you sit there in an ivory tower and justify these huge tax increases? You're just as oblivious as the teachers. Breaking news: There's a recession going on! How can it be that everyone should sacrifice except teachers?? If you're not a teacher you must be married to one.

[987987987]

Average teacher salary (2005 – 2006): $56,200

Average beginning teacher salary (2005 – 2006): $36,400

Median household income (Oct. 2007): $51,944


This from a site of teachers salaries by state. It doesn't seem out of line to me.

[Unregistered32332]

At a time when people are losing jobs, going into foreclosure, getting no salary increases, etc. how can you sit there in an ivory tower and justify these huge tax increases? You're just as oblivious as the teachers. Breaking news: There's a recession going on! How can it be that everyone should sacrifice except teachers?? If you're not a teacher you must be married to one.

Not a teacher nor married to one. Have none in the family. people take civil service jobs becasuse of SECURITY. WHen people are making money hand over fist in the private sector they look down at civil service jobs, too little money. When things get tough, then they cry about them. If being a teacher is lucrative and such few hours with such great benefits why didnt you become one? Ive been hearing that teachers are overpaid for twenty years. The forelosures are 90% idiots who took subprime loans or speculation building. Take a look at the figures, for the last decade Americans have vastly increased their debt while living high off the hog. Anyone with a lick of common sense knew it was going to come to an end. Thats why a year before the crash every dime I had in savings was in fixed accounts. And EVERYONE is not sacraficing. A lot of smart people actualy benefited, Im friends with a couple who are both Nurses ( a field with high demand by the way and decent pay) who took advantage of the downturn to buy a really nice house. My wife switched companies in the private sector less then a year ago and got a 10 thousand dollar raise. If teachers salarys go up 3% why the hell is the budget going up 7%, thats a better question. In my town we saw under a 3% raise in school taxes. Do you go into the grocery store and yell that the price of groceries goes up every year ? Everything generaly goes up every year. Not to mention that often during times of properity the public sector gets 3% raises . I worked for the County, the first year of my last contract was a very good year for the COunty, we got a big fat zero. In the end the public sectore generaly averages 3.25% a year. You pay high property taxes on long island becasue its a great place to live in high demand. Go to other parts of the Country and see what you get for far less taxes. I still see virtualy new $50 thousand dollar SUVs all over the road, I still see hour long waits at most eat out places. Sure, my wife had her salary frozen this year, but last year making a jump in companys netted over a 10% raise. Let me know when teachers get yearly double digit jumpsAnd dont even try to bring up that step garbage. That was originaly a cost savings move, new emplyees started a far less annual salary savingt the employers thousands. Now people act like their raises. Tell you what , give back the original starting salary and I promise theyll give step raises. Also, every company my wife has ever worked for offered to pay for going back to school. most offered raises when degrees where completed.

[do the math...]

Not a teacher nor married to one. Have none in the family. people take civil service jobs becasuse of SECURITY. WHen people are making money hand over fist in the private sector they look down at civil service jobs, too little money. When things get tough, then they cry about them. If being a teacher is lucrative and such few hours with such great benefits why didnt you become one? Ive been hearing that teachers are overpaid for twenty years. The forelosures are 90% idiots who took subprime loans or speculation building. Take a look at the figures, for the last decade Americans have vastly increased their debt while living high off the hog. Anyone with a lick of common sense knew it was going to come to an end. Thats why a year before the crash every dime I had in savings was in fixed accounts. And EVERYONE is not sacraficing. A lot of smart people actualy benefited, Im friends with a couple who are both Nurses ( a field with high demand by the way and decent pay) who took advantage of the downturn to buy a really nice house. My wife switched companies in the private sector less then a year ago and got a 10 thousand dollar raise. If teachers salarys go up 3% why the hell is the budget going up 7%, thats a better question. In my town we saw under a 3% raise in school taxes. Do you go into the grocery store and yell that the price of groceries goes up every year ? Everything generaly goes up every year. Not to mention that often during times of properity the public sector gets 3% raises . I worked for the County, the first year of my last contract was a very good year for the COunty, we got a big fat zero. In the end the public sectore generaly averages 3.25% a year. You pay high property taxes on long island becasue its a great place to live in high demand. Go to other parts of the Country and see what you get for far less taxes. I still see virtualy new $50 thousand dollar SUVs all over the road, I still see hour long waits at most eat out places. Sure, my wife had her salary frozen this year, but last year making a jump in companys netted over a 10% raise. Let me know when teachers get yearly double digit jumpsAnd dont even try to bring up that step garbage. That was originaly a cost savings move, new emplyees started a far less annual salary savingt the employers thousands. Now people act like their raises. Tell you what , give back the original starting salary and I promise theyll give step raises. Also, every company my wife has ever worked for offered to pay for going back to school. most offered raises when degrees where completed.

If your school taxes went up 3% then you are definitely at the low end of the scale. I'm talking about the last six years, not one. And to answer your question, the school budget goes up 7% when teacher salaries go up 3% BECAUSE THE SALARIES DON'T ONLY GO UP 3%. A 3% raise becomes a 5% raise (at least) when you factor in all of the hidden extras, such as step increases, pay for sports coaching, pay for proctoring, pay for being the drama coach, whatever. It all comes out of your pocket and into theirs. But you and your liberal tax-loving friends will never understand this.

[Unregistered434344]

If your school taxes went up 3% then you are definitely at the low end of the scale. I'm talking about the last six years, not one. And to answer your question, the school budget goes up 7% when teacher salaries go up 3% BECAUSE THE SALARIES DON'T ONLY GO UP 3%. A 3% raise becomes a 5% raise (at least) when you factor in all of the hidden extras, such as step increases, pay for sports coaching, pay for proctoring, pay for being the drama coach, whatever. It all comes out of your pocket and into theirs. But you and your liberal tax-loving friends will never understand this.

Step increases? YOu mean the original give back on starting salary of new teachers that saved the taxpayers thousands? Tell you, give up that give back, give all teachers new and old the same salary and you wont have step increases. So let me get this right, they werent paying the coaches , proctoring or drama coaches 7 years ago. If a teachers gets X amount for teaching and then X amount for coaching then from one year to the next it equates to a 3% raise. With your math skills no wonder your confused. I guess you just missed the GOP running the entire fucking Country into the ground. hey Thanks for giving my tax dollars to Bank CEOs, whew, what would have happened if those giys hadnt have gotten their 30 million dollar bonuses. But we better stop those teachers from getting a 3 or 4 percent raise. Thatll fix our economic problems. Now the GOP have been replaced with a bunch of Dems getting money hand over fist from private insurance companies but where going to complain about teachers and there HEalth care packages. The actual reason medical is so out of control, nah, we dont care about the actual reason, we just want teachers to pay more in health benefits. Hey numbnuts, why do you think a house that cost 650 grand here even with its 11 grand taxes would cost half that in much of the rest of the Country ? Dont want to pay high property taxes? I here you can own a home and 40 acres in places like Alabama and MIss for only 500 bucks a year in property taxes. One of the main reason your house is worth so much is you have one of the Countrys top education systems. YOu get what you pay for, wanna pay less, move someplace with shit for schools and public services.

By the way, those coaches in the school usualy coach a diffrent sport each season, the practices range from 2 to 3 hours. Generaly practice on the weekends, in the summer, on days off. And I swear to God, the marching bands gotta be out there like 4 hours. I drive by at 8 at night and their out there.

When the average home on Long Island cost over half a million bucks dont you think teachers should be paid enough to actualy live here ? If you put 20% down on the average house on Long Island your monthly payment in a 30 year mortgage, WITHOUT taxes will be over 2 grand a month. The guidline is your mortgage should be about 25% of your monthly GROSS income, and that payment guidline figures taxes in. So bascily to make it on Long ISland and own a home you need today your family needs to take home at least 10 grand a month. If you make 100 grand whats your take home a month ? Its about 6 grand. Youd probably glady pay teachers under 50, of course when your school district turned to shit and your home value plummeted youd be the first one crying about it. Last I heard 4 years of college and a Masters has a pretty hefty price tag, some big student loans generaly. Hey I know, lets get people with GEDs to teach in school, theyll do it for 30 grand.

Hey, if you dont like liberals im sure the deep south will welcome you with open arms, its cheaper , youll have a blast. Of course make sure you think evolution is myth, that the Dinosours died about 200 years before the Civil War and the Bible should replace our entire legal system ( even though their decendants actualy came to America to escape religous persecution from otheres who interperted the Bible diffrently then them)

Well miss yah, now beat it.

And hey, since your such a Conservative when you get their remind your elected officials how your anti tax and you want the Dem Blue States to stop paying ( welfare) to the Conservative run underfunded Red States. Now those are some tax dollars Id like to get back

[u r truly an idiot]

Step increases? YOu mean the original give back on starting salary of new teachers that saved the taxpayers thousands? Tell you, give up that give back, give all teachers new and old the same salary and you wont have step increases. So let me get this right, they werent paying the coaches , proctoring or drama coaches 7 years ago. If a teachers gets X amount for teaching and then X amount for coaching then from one year to the next it equates to a 3% raise. With your math skills no wonder your confused. I guess you just missed the GOP running the entire fucking Country into the ground. hey Thanks for giving my tax dollars to Bank CEOs, whew, what would have happened if those giys hadnt have gotten their 30 million dollar bonuses. But we better stop those teachers from getting a 3 or 4 percent raise. Thatll fix our economic problems. Now the GOP have been replaced with a bunch of Dems getting money hand over fist from private insurance companies but where going to complain about teachers and there HEalth care packages. The actual reason medical is so out of control, nah, we dont care about the actual reason, we just want teachers to pay more in health benefits. Hey numbnuts, why do you think a house that cost 650 grand here even with its 11 grand taxes would cost half that in much of the rest of the Country ? Dont want to pay high property taxes? I here you can own a home and 40 acres in places like Alabama and MIss for only 500 bucks a year in property taxes. One of the main reason your house is worth so much is you have one of the Countrys top education systems. YOu get what you pay for, wanna pay less, move someplace with shit for schools and public services.

By the way, those coaches in the school usualy coach a diffrent sport each season, the practices range from 2 to 3 hours. Generaly practice on the weekends, in the summer, on days off. And I swear to God, the marching bands gotta be out there like 4 hours. I drive by at 8 at night and their out there.

When the average home on Long Island cost over half a million bucks dont you think teachers should be paid enough to actualy live here ? If you put 20% down on the average house on Long Island your monthly payment in a 30 year mortgage, WITHOUT taxes will be over 2 grand a month. The guidline is your mortgage should be about 25% of your monthly GROSS income, and that payment guidline figures taxes in. So bascily to make it on Long ISland and own a home you need today your family needs to take home at least 10 grand a month. If you make 100 grand whats your take home a month ? Its about 6 grand. Youd probably glady pay teachers under 50, of course when your school district turned to shit and your home value plummeted youd be the first one crying about it. Last I heard 4 years of college and a Masters has a pretty hefty price tag, some big student loans generaly. Hey I know, lets get people with GEDs to teach in school, theyll do it for 30 grand.

Hey, if you dont like liberals im sure the deep south will welcome you with open arms, its cheaper , youll have a blast. Of course make sure you think evolution is myth, that the Dinosours died about 200 years before the Civil War and the Bible should replace our entire legal system ( even though their decendants actualy came to America to escape religous persecution from otheres who interperted the Bible diffrently then them)

Well miss yah, now beat it.

And hey, since your such a Conservative when you get their remind your elected officials how your anti tax and you want the Dem Blue States to stop paying ( welfare) to the Conservative run underfunded Red States. Now those are some tax dollars Id like to get back

I am a Democrat and have been one for almost 30 years. But I'm not a bleeding heart liberal democrat who doesn't care where his tax dollars go. The gym teachers at my son's high school make more than $130k per year. Doesn't that make you raise your eyebrows even a little? $130k for rolling out the balls and carrying a whistle? We pay for this. It comes out of our pockets. You don't even care??? For the amount of work they do (summers off, all the holidays, unlimited sick leave, etc) yes I think they are vastly overpaid.

And no, you're dead wrong about the raises. My district just agreed to a 2.5% increase but when you factor in the step increases it's a 4.42% raise. I suggest you're the one who needs to sharpen his math skills.

I ask again, why do they need longevity pay if they have tenure? Do you even have a justification for that???

[Unregistered34343]

I am a Democrat and have been one for almost 30 years. But I'm not a bleeding heart liberal democrat who doesn't care where his tax dollars go. The gym teachers at my son's high school make more than $130k per year. Doesn't that make you raise your eyebrows even a little? $130k for rolling out the balls and carrying a whistle? We pay for this. It comes out of our pockets. You don't even care??? For the amount of work they do (summers off, all the holidays, unlimited sick leave, etc) yes I think they are vastly overpaid.


My school district is incredible,im thrilled with it, Gym teacher sdont make that in base pay. ARe the Gym teachers your talking about coaching ? ARe they showing before school, staying hours after , coaching as well on SAt and Holidays as well as in the summer / WHen I ride by the High school in AUgust is the Football team out their by itself with no coach? ANd I noticed you picked on the Gym teacher. How about the MAth and Science teachers with MAsters, did you miss them ? And with housing prices what they are how much money do you think you need to live on long Island. ?

And no, you're dead wrong about the raises. My district just agreed to a 2.5% increase but when you factor in the step increases it's a 4.42% raise. I suggest you're the one who needs to sharpen his math skills.


No you just dont understand . Years ago there was what a teacher made period. 1st year or year 29 , didnt make a diffrence, A teachers pay was a teachers pay. as a GIVE BACK, starting teachers salaries where LOWERED and SAVINGS accomplished by not paying them what the salary was at the time. The new teachers would now have to work for 5 or 10 years to receive the same pay as a teacher who was already ther even though they both had the same exact workload. Probaly over half your teachers are at top pay so they dont get step raises. If youd like GIVE BACK THE SAVINGS . pay all teachers the same from the get go and you wont have step raises

Again if a teacher makes say 70 grand for teaching reg classes and then gets say another 20 grand for coaching in 2008 and then he gets a 3 % raise on his reg pay and coaching pay how the fuck do your taxes go up 7 %

I ask again, why do they need longevity pay if they have tenure? Do you even have a justification for that???

I havent read their CBA. But generaly tenure has NOTHING to do with tenure. Tenure is when a teacher has a certain amount of time in and a School systme cannot fire them at a whim. In order to fire them they must bring them up and charges which they can prove. Tenure has NOTHING to do with pay. Lonegtivity is generaly given in the form of a bonus after having a ceratin amount of time on the job.

So basicly your confused about tenure and longevity, you dont understand the history of the step raises and you claim your Gym teachers make 130 grand , dont stay after school class hours, work weekends holidays or summers , correct ? Either your wrong or you live in COld SPring HArbor or somewhere comparable where your home value is in the millions

[Unregistered343433]

[QUOTE=Unregistered34343;329450]I havent read their CBA. But generaly tenure has NOTHING to do with tenure.

Should have been " NOTHING to do with longevity "

[not confused at all]

I havent read their CBA. But generaly tenure has NOTHING to do with tenure. Tenure is when a teacher has a certain amount of time in and a School systme cannot fire them at a whim. In order to fire them they must bring them up and charges which they can prove. Tenure has NOTHING to do with pay. Lonegtivity is generaly given in the form of a bonus after having a ceratin amount of time on the job.

So basicly your confused about tenure and longevity, you dont understand the history of the step raises and you claim your Gym teachers make 130 grand , dont stay after school class hours, work weekends holidays or summers , correct ? Either your wrong or you live in COld SPring HArbor or somewhere comparable where your home value is in the millions

I read the most recent contract in my district. I know what it says about step pay, longevity and tenure. I'm not confused at all. Their security is locked in. If security is locked in then longevity is not an achievement. If it's not an achievement then it doesn't deserve a bonus. Do you think they should get a bonus for just showing up? That's ridiculous. And I don't CLAIM my son's gym teachers make $130k, I looked it up on seethroughny.net. The only reason they make that much is because they have been teaching here for a while. Their $130k is base, it does NOT include any coaching money. That's extra. I'm glad none of this bothers you. I just can't go through life with blinders on.

[Unregistered34443]

I read the most recent contract in my district. I know what it says about step pay, longevity and tenure. I'm not confused at all. Their security is locked in. If security is locked in then longevity is not an achievement. If it's not an achievement then it doesn't deserve a bonus. Do you think they should get a bonus for just showing up? That's ridiculous.


Yet most private company increases vacation time the longer you have with the company. SHould you get increasaed Vacation just for showing up ? They do. And after a ceratin amount of time in most private companies the company kicks up its investment in your retirement, just for showing up. WHat tenure means is you cant be fired on a whim. How many times have we heard of private companies firing somone 2 days before there pension was about to be locked in ? Do you think thats right ? ANd al longevity means is that if you DO your job you cant be fired. They can still be fired if they dont do ther job. Lonevity pay is sighted in virtualy every single CBA yoiull ever see.

WHy dont you tell me how the steps first came into being and its purpose ? AGain, it was originaly a cost savings. YOur actualy bitching that new teachers start at less money now.


If your Gym teachers are making that money in base pay then your living in an exsculsive area, in a mutil million dollar house and one of the best schools in the entire Country

[tax guy]

I think the disparity in benefits to teachers goe back to the days of old when teachers were, by all objectvie measures, underpaid.

That has long since changed. Especially on six-figure Long Island. However, the benefits structure has not changed to reflect benefits given to now highly paid employees. The benies need to reflcet the new reality.

[wake up to reality]

I read the most recent contract in my district. I know what it says about step pay, longevity and tenure. I'm not confused at all. Their security is locked in. If security is locked in then longevity is not an achievement. If it's not an achievement then it doesn't deserve a bonus. Do you think they should get a bonus for just showing up? That's ridiculous.


Yet most private company increases vacation time the longer you have with the company. SHould you get increasaed Vacation just for showing up ? They do. And after a ceratin amount of time in most private companies the company kicks up its investment in your retirement, just for showing up. WHat tenure means is you cant be fired on a whim. How many times have we heard of private companies firing somone 2 days before there pension was about to be locked in ? Do you think thats right ? ANd al longevity means is that if you DO your job you cant be fired. They can still be fired if they dont do ther job. Lonevity pay is sighted in virtualy every single CBA yoiull ever see.

WHy dont you tell me how the steps first came into being and its purpose ? AGain, it was originaly a cost savings. YOur actualy bitching that new teachers start at less money now.


If your Gym teachers are making that money in base pay then your living in an exsculsive area, in a mutil million dollar house and one of the best schools in the entire Country

I live in a middle class area. My district has 3x more teachers making $100k as Bellmore-Merrick, yet the Bellmore-Merrick district is just as good as mine, and taxes are lower. The gym teachers here make $130k because they have been teaching here a long time and because they have a master's +60. I'll repeat my earlier question - what value does it add having a gym teacher with a master's +60? None. Here's another question: if the teachers in my district were offered a take it or leave it contract with a 1% raise, do you know how many would leave? Zero.

Now about your comparing apples and oranges - the difference between the private sector and my school district is I'M PAYING FOR THE TEACHERS' SALARIES + BENNIES.

Again, I don't put all of the blame on the teachers. The school boards are trustees of the public money, but they all too often act like they're in bed with the teachers. They have shown in the past they will give away the store if people don't pay attention. Get involved and stay involved.