SCPD Decertification

[Taxpayer]

What's the story?

Heard the big bosses got letters from Mr. Levy? Anyone know anything?

[brutus]

Et Tu, Brute! :">

[Question]

OK, sound dumb here, what does the decertification mean to the Police Department?

[PERB]

that depends on your point of view...police officer or civilian?

[WhatTheHellDoIknow]

I think it means your demoted or lose your title.

[Answerman]

Without getting too confusing, Levy is trying to "separate" the ranks of deputy inspectors up through chiefs from the union. The claim is that these ranks are "policy makers" within the department, and therefore belonging to the union brings about a conflict of interests (i.e. fox guarding the hen house).

Ultimately, this will probably affect the big bosses (high ranking chiefs). If it goes through, I would bet we'll see some more retirements...

[More retirements]

Mass exodus. Examine the NYPD they don't have DI/Inspectors running all of their pct.s Lotsa waste above the rank of Capt. Dump the redundant salaries and you can staff a lot of sector cars and Detective positions.

[iseethefuture]

Look into the future...

Levy won't dump ALL the decertified positions (although i'm sure they will get rid of some of them to tout more "savings").

No qualified captain will want a promotion to a decertified position, so what's the next move? Civilianize the spots to appointed positions. Then we will have more political hacks in the department...this time running the divisions.

Think things are bad now? If that happens, watch out!

[scpd patrol]

Oh yeah, this will fill up top spots with political hacks. I have no animosity towards the NYPD, but look at Nassau County brining in former NYPD to "run" things. Not very promising in my book. On top of that, we'll have people (political hacks) there with no police background at all making up policy and procedure.

What's the point in studying hard, making ranks through Captain and then trying to make those people realize that because they have not been police officers, some of their policies are flawed. Will these new "police commanders" accept input from actual police officers. I think back to Vietnam and to some extent, the war in Iraq and wonder why politicians have to override the military? Look what those policies did!

I believe morale will be beaten down again if this happens. i guess we'll have to wait and see what happens at PERB.

[I wanna know]

Regardless of the outcome I want Levy/Dormer to publish the amount of money it will take the county to defend and implement it's decertification process. How much money it will cost the County Attorney's office or how much in private Counsel it will cost the county since it is obvious there currently exists a conflict of interest. In addition I would imagine that hiring outside consultants for Employee Relations will be required. I want to know what the bottom line in this Levy dream is going to cost regardless of the outcome. I feel periodic accounting updates of the costs involved should be made available to the public. Another question- If Levy is so sure of and can back up the decision to shut down cars why would he vow to veto a proposal by Angie Carpenter calling for an outside consultant to examine the Department and give an objective outsiders opinion of staffing. I will answer my own question, Levy/Dormer know that any credible outside consultant will recommend the hiring and redeployment of many new officers and the removal of the "political hacks". The Dems and the Reps like the system just the way it is. How can you expect to run a campaign regardless of party affiliation without having a means of rewarding the political faithful. One just need look at the slew of Detective Designations and promotion appointments above the rank of Captain to see that Steve/Rich are talking out both sides of their faces. I am truly saddened and dissapointed, I was hoping for so much more from them. I was naive to think they would really make a change. All they have accomplished is to make the streets less safe and continue the political patronage appointment system. The sad part is that in 4 years the same thing will happen all over again when the next CE and his lap dog of a Police Commissioner get into office. As much as things change they will remain the same. Different faces, same patronage system.

[White Nightee]

We got a groovy kinda love.

[deuce]

We just got rid of a hack, non-police patronage comissioner. Jeez this place is going down the tubes real quick.

[Question]

anyone know how last night's special soa meeting went?

[NY JAG]

it went great they said they will never hire any more unqualified drug dealing/using perverts again and fire every one working now, also they will get real police like nypd etc
Stay in the private sector and make alot more money and people have more respect for you, stop giving them 100 buks so they cant use your money.

[Ill wait for you]

I agree Jag. Abuse and humiliation are what they're best at. Then they doctor reports to make it "routine". Because abuse and humiliation are routine.

Safe trip Brian, Im sure you'll met your match and get what you have coming

[Ill be waiting 4 U]

Take your "filthy hairy c@nt" with you. Its not fair of her to stalk me in her blue japmobile, because of you. Last time she had the kid with her. She knows your guilty anyway, you've smashed her too. Next time she's gonna have a harrassment report. See ya in court Porky!

[Hell fit right in]

He'll fit right in......over there.....in the prison. Thats his forte':">

[Wondering]

This topic has been pretty quiet. Anyone know of anything new on this front?

[cracked head]

Quote: it went great they said they will never hire any more unqualified drug dealing/using perverts again and fire every one working now, also they will get real police like nypd etc

Fire people? Like you got fired jagoff? And, aside from posting at the NYPD Rant page, do you know anything about NYPD?

I DOUBT IT!!!!!

[scpd patrol]

Learned the other day that decertification is still moving along. Any of the bosses involved shpould be putting their papers in to protect themselves. They can pull them and resubmit them

[Citizen Cain]

I'm stymied that the highest paid memebers of the police...the people that make the management decisions...are members of the union!

Is this why the police salaries are so high? Some chiefs sit around and decide to give the cops (and themselves) 4% raises?

I'm all for unions and labor rights, but there has to be some distinction between the workers and the managers.

[birdie]

Doesn't work that way. A negotiating committee appointed by the County Executive negotiates a labor contract with the unions. When they get nowhere it goes to binding arbitration, which is usually the case. The chiefs play no role whatsoever in contract negotiations.

[culoloden1745]

chiefs have no contract, that is why they are screwing w/ them.

[IBEW]

don't the cheif's get the same contract as the sergeants,etc?

What does decertification have to do with not having a contract? They go without a contract, like, every 4 years, dont they?

[culloden1745]

i'm not 100% on this, since i'm not a chief, not even a sgt. but because they have no contract the admin can attempt to change the chiefs package. sgt are members of soa, superior officers which is their union. in a nutshell whatever we bargain for, they usually get, as far as any labor contract, when the old 1 expires, it is still in effect until there is a new 1.a good example is the sick time buy out they want the chiefs to go from 1/2 day to 1/4, that will be decided in court, us, we have to agree before the contract is approved,if we cant agree then it goes to arbitration, very rare does any union lose things in arbitration,at worst it remains status quo. i hope thats pretty close to reality, maybe someone that is actually involved w/ these things could explain it better.

[birdie]

Chiefs have a contract. They belong to the SOA with Sgts, Lts, etc. The whole decertification process involves removing chiefs and inspectors from the SOA so the county can take away their negotiated items.

[culloden]

so stevie's trying to civilianize them so he can screw w/ them? thats beautiful, good luck finding new bosses stevie

[huh]

I don't quite understand how he can separate members from their union. Isn't that considered "union busting" and therefore against the law.

Also, he is targeting D/I's and higher. What is to prevent them from pulling the plug and returning to their last civil service rank (captain)? Then, they get the last laugh and keep their scat check and pension...

[birdie]

Chiefs and inspectors can't return to captain unless there are positions open for them. They can't demote to create positions. They have to either suck it up and lose everything to hang on to their rank, or retire before the decertification process is complete, to keep their scat pay.

[deuce]

All those who kissed little Steves ass to get the appointments to their new positions are getting screwed royally by the weasel they supported. I bet they're glad now!!!

[culloden1745]

4. think they all retire, who is gonna replace them, give up their nestegg? he'd have to hire outside the dept. this could be a civilian post before you know it. then it would really be a disaster

[scpd patrol]

make way for the political hacks!!

[scpd patrol]

Anything new going on? I haven't heard much lately

[Decertification]

Anything new going on? I haven't heard much lately

[Stevie is]

He wouldn't dare piss off those that he promoted. Then they would out him for all of his dirty deeds, or just out him in general and then he would have to do a McGreevey and step down.

[watchingstevie]

nassau's 4 top uniforms were decertified last week

[TheChief]

Is that true?!? I know Suozzi was trying to decertify his chiefs, and was ahead of Stevie in the process, but didn't know it had happened. No articles or anything else (unless they are waiting to make a big press splash).

If that's the case, things aren't looking too good for Suffolk's bosses. Anyone know where they are in the process?

[aaaaaaaaaaaa]

Not top 4 uniforms. word was leaked by cancelleri that top 3 chiefs, chief of department (4 star), chief of patrol (3 star), chief of detective (3 star), will have change of status when soa contract award comes out. This sets stage for what current member of department would ever take that job with no protection of benefits? No one. suozzi will be free to seek outside appointments, more city people he can bring in.

[just curious]

He's bringing in more City people because they actually work.

[thats comforting]

get what kind of work done? certainly not legal

[aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa]

Nassau County had, and not withstanding how suozzi has cut the department, the finest reputation for a police department in the country. Not knocking NYPD, SCPD, but give me a break. They are great departments. There is no other police department in the country that is better at providing quality service to the residents it serves, and is corruption free. This topic was about decertification, an uion issue, but you showed your obvious jealousy and bias. If you have a axe to grind, start another thread and rant all you want.

[UnionMan]

Is this an actual perb decertification, or a new NCPD SOA contract with new provisions for the 4 chiefs?

In any case, how will this affect SCPD bosses? Levy is trying to decertify EVERYONE above the rank of Captain...

[sensei]

wait and see, seems like they both are up to the same thing. so we'll just watch and learn, best thing levy is gone in 2 years

[scpd patrol]

Has Levy actually filed anything with the State as of yet?

[Union Rumors]

Levy filed with state PERB in august, all members above captain were advised by letter shortly thereafter.

General consesus is that the top 4 chiefs will be decertified, just like Nassau PD. Probably happen just into the new year

[watchingstevie]

suffolk soa looking to get nassau deal...same lawyer, saves benies for those lesser chief ranks....suff hearing yesterday...results tba

[scpd patrol]

Thank you.

[scpd patrol]

Any new news??

[scpd patrol]

Dormer has started to clean house. If you haven't heard yet, read today's Newsday. I wonder how many will stay on as Capt.? It appears that there isn't much movement in the decertification area.

[sucking your thumb]

ACCUSED OF HELPING THIEVES
Ex-cop charged in burglaries
BY ALFONSO A. CASTILLO
STAFF WRITER

November 18, 2004

A retired Suffolk County police officer has been charged with assisting thieves in three separate commercial burglaries and was on duty during at least one of the heists, Suffolk prosecutors said yesterday.

Raymond Montefusco, 36, of East Northport, who retired on disability earlier this year from his job as a police officer in the Third Precinct, surrendered yesterday to Suffolk County Court Judge James Hudson and was arraigned on 15 separate charges, including three counts of third-degree burglary. Montefusco faces a maximum of 7 to 21 years in prison on the burglary charges alone, officials said.


Montefusco pleaded not guilty to the charges and was released without bail, even though prosecutors asked the judge to set bail at $10,000.

Montefusco's defense attorney, Paul Gianelli of Hauppauge, said yesterday his client "completely denies" the charges. He said Montefusco has "an impeccable background" and is an Air Force veteran who served in the Persian Gulf War.

Assistant District Attorney Peter Timmons said Montefusco had a hand in the November 1999 burglary of a King Kullen supermarket in Bay Shore, the January 2000 burglary of Parsnips restaurant in Lake Ronkonkoma and the July 2000 burglary of a St. James Jiffy Lube.

Timmons, who said the charges were the result of an extensive grand jury investigation, would not elaborate on what role Montefusco played in the robberies, except that "this guy was at the scene or near the scene where these crimes were being committed." Gianelli said prosecutors are alleging that Montefusco used his radio to tip off burglars to the location of police.

Timmons said Montefusco was on duty in his patrol car while assisting in the 1999 supermarket heist.

"Nothing really betrays the public trust more than someone in a position of public trust committing these crimes," Timmons said.

Gianelli maintains that Montefusco was falsely implicated by another suspect arrested in a burglary. That suspect knows Montefusco and accused him "in hopes that he could get leniency," Gianelli said, adding that his client is "devastated" by the charges.

"He's used to putting handcuffs on people," Gianelli said, "not having them put on him."

[you are in your glory]

NO ONE from this job will have anything to say in this guy's defense. He gave us all a black eye. He'll have his day in court and if the allegation is true, then he'll have plenty of time to sit in prison and think what a jerk he is!!

[on the air]

Thomas Foley, who was honored as a Cop of the Month by the Suffolk County Police Department three years ago, has been on medical leave because of a work-related injury. Sergeant Grettler has been on modified duty because of a domestic dispute with his girlfriend, city police officials said. It Happens. The Best trained officers in the world are still only human.

[AllChiefsNoIndians]

Without getting too confusing, Levy is trying to "separate" the ranks of deputy inspectors up through chiefs from the union. The claim is that these ranks are "policy makers" within the department, and therefore belonging to the union brings about a conflict of interests (i.e. fox guarding the hen house).


PERB Rules:

Employees may be designated as managerial only if they are persons (i) who formulate policy or (ii) who may reasonably be required on behalf of the public employer to assist directly in the preparation for and conduct of collective negotiations or to have a major role in the administration of agreements or in personnel administration provided that such role is not of a routine or clerical nature and requires the exercise of independent judgment. Employees may be designated as confidential only if they are persons who assist and act in a confidential capacity to managerial employees described in clause (ii).

... members in the rank of captain designated as assistant chief and higher shall be designated as managerial and confidential employees; members in the rank of captain, deputy inspector, inspector and deputy chief or lower shall not be so designated, unless a final determination to the contrary results from a petition to decertify (or from an action to otherwise designate any or all such members as managerial or confidential employees)

http://www.perb.state.ny.us/stat.asp

:twisted: