Paid First Responders/Paramedics

[Stonybrook Resident]

Why can't we get a paid paramedic to be on call 24/7 like
Setauket FD has? Why are we forced to wait for treatment when Setauket has a first responder on call all of the time? If we cant afford our won, why dont we chip in and offer to help pay Setauket's if they will cover Stonybrook also? It isnt that big of an area.

[Medic]

The way it works is the wealthiest communities on Long Island (like Stony Brook) have inexperienced EMTs and no medics, while those that live in the filthiest housing projects in all of Brooklyn or Queens will have two paramedics, two experienced EMTs and a whole engine company of firefighters at their door in 5 minutes if the need arises. Quite ironic if you ask me.

[for paid]

b/c the vollies want to hold onto their money. when some political figure head finally looses someone medical or fire related then things will change, then again the vollies will probably give them a plaque or honor them. it is exceptable for a 10 min respone for an ambulance or fire truck or engine!!! What has any politician done for the fire service to help retain or recruit? LOSAP = a joke, Tax Deduction = a joke, College $$ = a joke. To collect LOSAP you must be (in most towns) 55-62 varies, tax deduc if you own a house and not very substantial, college most kids going to college arent interested nor have time to vollunteer and older members don't seem to be taking advantage of whatever it is that program has to offer. PAID EMS, contracted out from area hospital don't pay the district or municipality but the member directly who use ambulance paid for by taxpayer of the area covering!! The ambulance is going to their call anyway so if the district can get the hospital to pay for the manning there's your PAID EMS. The district isn't going to have to pay out anymore then what their paying now for insurance and fuel, I wouldn't think! Fuel - they would be using wheather vollie or paid and insurance for members - well if there working for the hospital then wouldn't they be responsible or split with district????

[SetauketMrs]

You should consider yourself lucky stonybrook, some of the medics at Setauket are oddballs, one looks like he ran away from Lynyrd Skynyrd. EMT's can get you the same results if done right and they don't wate time waiting for the medics to show up anyway.

[ya ok]

EMT's #1 can never do a medics job. How many EMT's do you see intubate a person when they are in arrest or failure? How many EMT's have you seen pace a 3rd degree h/b? NONE!! I rest my case.
I am a volunteer FF/Paramedic and I work f/t as a Paramedic. The fire service on LI is running fine. It is the EMS service that needs to be a PAID system. You need a health system like NSUH to come take it over or maybe SCPD run a similar style program like Nassau but have it paired up as EMT/Medic instead of having just a Medic in a bus all alone....Just my 2 Cents

[EMTP]

Look, its not just the "rich" departments that have paid P's...West Babylon has seven (7) P's on their paid staff with two more on the vollie side. The supervisor is a P and on site to cover ALS calls when there's not a P or CC on duty.

All any department has to do is make the commitment to give the highest degree of service that they can...

[FF]

EVERY Suffolk Police Officer is trained to AT LEAST an EMT level.
It is easier for most fire departments to get at least a driver for an ambulance during the day.
Instead of blowing 3's or 24 a call why are we not utilizing the EMT on scene(po) and the driver at the FD ?

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SugarBrune (http://camslivesexy.com/cam/SugarBrune)

[LT]

Before i was even an EMT we used to do that in my dept right before a 24 we would ask if the sector car could ride with us and 98% the answer was yes we were asked by SCOD to stop doing that it was hurting there police force from doing "police work" i can understand to a point a cop sitting on an aided belly pn that the person has had for weeks and now a armed robbery comes in 3 blocks away and he is on the bus with FD kinda hurts the PD system anyway well hoped that helped....

[LT]

I am sorry i ment "SCPD Suffolk County" had a lil typo last statement

[FF]

Yes i've seen it done too, rarely though.
But is doing "police work" more important than the care of a person in need ? Seems to still be police work.........
and as far as that "cop sitting on an aided belly pn that the person has had for weeks"
The cop maybe could do a little investigative work and determine that person needs a taxi not an ambulance.

Thats another reason our ems system is failing, transporting people who really dont need an ambulance, just a taxi.
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REINA4U cam (http://camslivesexy.com/cam/REINA4U)

[tards]

Where the hell did this idea even come from?!?!?! Taking the cops and putting them on the ambulance!!!!! They are cops, we are medics...they investigate crimes, we take sick people to the hospital. Sure, we're all emergency responders, but we each serve a specific purpose and each one is necessary for a functioning society. The reason the cops are trained to EMT level is because the piece of s**t ambulance services around here can't get their act together and get an ambulance to an emergency fast enough, so they might as well do some basic things before the poor person dies. Plus, it's not like the cops don't have anything to do when the ambulance call is finished...they probably have a job waiting for them to go back in service


You know, there are many more reasons that this is beyond ridiculous. I would bet this is the only place in the country with morons that would come up with such a stupid idea. Why don't you people get the local garbageman or mail carrier or public works employee to put down what they're doing and drive the ambulance for you. Maybe they should be trained as EMTs and should respond on EMS calls just in case no one from the ambulance bothers to show up. HEY, THAT'S A GREAT IDEA!!!!!!!!

[A Pointed View]

As a 30 year member of a fire/ems department it is my opinion that we have to accept that at least a paid first responder system will have to be in place in Suffolk. Demographics, income and the two income family have cut into the available pool of volunteer manpower.

My department was one of the first to go paid first responder and now is 24/7. My problem is not with the departments that do this, I applaud the Commissioners and Officers who have put the medical care of their community above their volunteer pride.

The problem as I see it is that individual departments are attacking this problem with wide disapritys on coverage times, level of the FR, mutual aids, etc ... This is a county wide problem and should be addressed by the county. Politicians run scared from vollies because we are a powerful voting bloc. They need to "act" rather than "react" before this becomes a crisis. And we need to point out to them that there is a problem now, and a bigger one coming in the not too distant future.

Are the needs different for East Marion from East Farmingdale or between Copaigue and Cutchogue.. sure, but rather than having individual departments attack this 800 pound future gorilla we should be addressing the problem before it explodes in our faces.
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Meliya (http://www.girlcamfriend.com/cam/Meliya/)

[BUFF]

I know that the Coram FD pays a CC and a P as a crew from Midnight to 0900 and 0900 to 1800. This allows for ALS coverage 18 hours a day, and still leaves 1800 to 2400 for the volunteers to cover. The fireman are very supportive of the paid crews. The other great thing is that during the day if they get a double hit, they can steal a houseman or vollies to split up and have 2 ALS crews. It seems to work really well, and they have been doing it for approx 2 years now without much problem. Originally they were abused by the surrounding departments, but now the commissioners have set guidelines and most of the surrounding districts finally went out and got their own ALS responders. For the most part they seem to get along with the other districts. The best part about this system, the public is covered and the FD stepped up to protect them. You know why????? Because they realized they could not do it with vollies anymore. Not saying this is for everyone, some don't need to go this far, but I will tell you I like it and I wish it was in my town. Be Safe out there......

[FF]

What? Are YOU the MORON?

Your saying its better to throw a call around for 30 minutes while an emt (po) and a driver (fd) sit in 2 locations waiting for more people?

Lets see now .......lets sit in an aideds house for half an hour waiting for the ambulance, or why dont i just ride along and get this done so I CAN go back to "real" police work.

Oh and by the way ? How do you think nassau does it?
The busses are driven by an emt/cc/medic, whatever, when they get a run a po from the scene then drives for them.

And again MAYBE a little "investigative" work by the po can weed out some of the BS calls.
ie:There is NO reason for someone with a headache,with 5 cars in the driveway and 5 competent people home,TO CALL AN AMBULANCE!!!!!!!!!!
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red head Webcams (http://www.girlcamfriend.com/webcam/redhead-girls/)

[cfdff]

.....to you guys getting the bus out during the day, the area really has gotten crazy with the amount of runs we do. I'm just glad the commish office finally saw the problem and stepped up to the plate.



SEE YOU ALL AT THE 75th PARADE AND CARNIVAL THIS WEEKEND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BoBo]

Here's what I'm saying...if your department is at the point where you need to have a cop take an hour or more out of his shift to do the JOB of the ambulance, then you need to pay someone to staff your rig RIGHT NOW. If Nassau PD feels like that's the best way to do it, then let them do it. I think they're doing the wrong thing and I think everyone else in the country would agree judging by how popular that system is (e.g. nobody else does it the way they do).
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Honda nx650 (http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/Honda_NX650)

[ConcernedTech]

Most of these posts point to the underlying problem. The main issue here seems to be "How can we fix the VOLUNTEER system", instead of "How can we fix the SYSTEM". The long and the short of it is that as EMS providers, we have a mission to accomplish. There is no "I tried", or "Maybe if we change this it COULD possibly conceivably hopefully work". You either accomplish the job that you are entrusted with, or you don't. There is no in between. The volunteer system worked for a long time. The time is here, unfortunately, that we HAVE TO look to other ways. Any department that says that their volunteers are doing it alone, and that they're good enough has a serious problem. If you are 24'ing ANY calls, you need to look at the problem and fix it. Some departments have paid personnel and are still mutual aiding calls: then I say you don't have enough paid coverage. Pride is great, but the public doesn't care about how happy the volunteers are. they care that there is an ambulance at their house when they need it.

What about combining resources? The Shirley-Mastic MASH system is a good example. They both have EMT (housemen) on duty who respond to jobs. They also share an ALS first responder unit to cover ALS calls, or second hits.

We need to start thinking outside the box. Share resources and set up formal mutual aid agreements. If dept #1 has a driver available, see if dept#2 can get a tech to go with him. Or vice versa. Forget our little districts and your pride and look at the greater good.

That's all I got.

[BUFF]

Basically something needs to be done in certain places and in others they just might need to brush up on the current system. I think what everyone needs to understand is that no one system is right or wrong. What matters is what is going to work for us to do our job, serve the public. I think everyone has lost touch with that fact. Some systems use responders, some use crews, some use fire responders with ems crews, some use Police to assist. Whatever the system is, it must work for now or they wouldn't use it. Every system is going to need overhauls at sometime. You have to be able to adapt with the times or else you become extinct. If we didn't we would still be pushing 2 amps of bicarb first line on cardiac arrests. I have some ideas as to what we could do in Suffolk County, but people aren't going to like what I have to say. I say it to anyone who wants to listen, but I keep my opinions to myself unless asked. I think the volunteers are a great part of this system, I am one, but the time has come for some reality. The reality is with an increase in call volume and a decrease in volunteers it is becoming harder and harder for the districts to cover their calls. Not only that but even the volunteers we do have, are strapped for time. It isn't the old days anymore. I would never get rid of volunteers, but they definitely need supplementation. Anyone who doesn't think so need only listen to Medcom Dispatch some day. Fire Dept's are different, but they are struggling too. All that can be said for now is keep rocking guys and gals. Do the best you can and be safe.

[ExCaptEMS]

First off, the average PO on SCPD is an EMT by default, and is really a CFR with an EMT card. They are not trained to run calls, don't know the radio system, arent familiar with hospital ERs and can't do a patient presentation. SCPD is understaffed, and has been for many years. The precincts cannot afford to send the POs on ambulances several times a day for an hour each time. There are hundreds of aided calls all day long. The dept started the EMT program back in 1987. The reason for it was that in 1986 the Suffolk EMS Task Force report requested that SCPD train all the POs to the EMT level as a stopgap measure to help the patients get needed care early. Unfortunately, the dept never gave them the tools to do the job. They have oxygen, a first aid kit, and an AED. No bp cuffs, no OB kits, no trauma kits, KEDs, backboards etc. It simply wasnt a priority to the bosses in charge. And rightfully so. The SCPD is a police agency and ambulance calls are not its primary function. The commissioner at the time was from Nassauland, and he felt it might help. It was a nice gesture, but in theory was a waste of money. The EMS system was supposed to improve based on the task force's recommendations. Guess what? It never happened! EMS still has the same problems it did in 1986. When SCPD started the EMT program and even later when they started using AEDs, the vollies complained bitterly. Can you imagine the uproar if the PD bought some ambulances!!! Now you want to dump the calls on the police dept. Well sorry, it doesnt work that way. If the EMS agencies would get their act together and fix things that have been languishing for 20 years, we wouldnt be having this discussion!!
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Coach Handbags (http://icoachhandbags.com/)

[FF]

"Can you imagine the uproar if the PD bought some ambulances!!!"

I got news for you, THEY ALREADY HAVE AMBULANCES!!!
That is a FACT! Painted and marked "Suffolk County Police Ambulance"

Why shouldnt the po's back up our ems system, might go a little way to JUSTIFYING their $100,000.00 exsistance!!!
________
ROLL A JOINT (http://howtorollajoint.net/)

[ExCaptEMS]

Sorry Sonny, that's ONE ambulance! It is assigned to the Police Academy. It says "Police Academy" in big blue letters on the module. Next time you are in Brentwood, stop by and check it out. It transports injured police officers to the hosp if they are injured during training exercises. It does interfacility transports of members who need it due to their medical condition or injury. It does not do 911 and wasn't appropriated to do so. So now the truth comes out..it's the jealousy of the salary that you so convieniently inflated. Economically, using police officers to man ambulances is not cost effective, and would probably generate more taxes. Even though, in the long run, with the proper training, professional police officers fulfilling a dual role as EMTs, CCs or medics, would probably do a much better job. They are disciplined, more receptive to training, which would be enhanced by their day to day experience, wouldn't pick or choose their calls, and would get to the scene much faster. Greenburgh PD upstate runs their EMS system with a lot of success. The problem here is that county government will never foot the bill.
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Black dick (http://www.fucktube.com/categories/295/dick/videos/1)

[ems]

Theres more than 1 and not ALL of them say academy either.
Go take a look at headquarters in Yaphank, or take a ride over to ESU by the airport.

[FFEMT]

Suffolk Co. posted for the positions below on there website back in April. Not sure if this is for the SCPD ambulances or for another reason but they are looking for EMTs and Paramedics.

APPLICATIONS ARE ACCEPTED AND ADDED CONTINUALLY FOR THE FOLLOWING TITLES:
SPECIFICATION # TITLE BI-WEEKLY SALARY
2041
2670 EMERGENCY MEDICAL TECHNICIAN (BASIC) OC Usual Bi-Weekly Salary $961-$1153**
2673 EMERGENCY MEDICAL TECHNICIAN
(CRITICAL CARE) OC Usual Bi-Weekly Salary $1200-$1365**
2674 EMERGENCY MEDICAL TECHNICIAN
(PARAMEDIC) OC Usual Bi-Weekly Salary $1520**

[LI EMS]

So now you think the police dept. is hiring ambulance personnel because of what you found on there? I'm sure you just cracked the conspiracy wide open. Someone should give you a medal.

I believe you probably got that info from the civil service web site and I'm pretty sure some of the ambulance/fire departments in the county hire off of the list. Unless of course they skell out and hire "janitors" who, by the way, when they are not scrubbing toilets, are responding on calls the vollies can't cover.

[ExCaptEMS]

Those trucks you are referring to are 6 new ESU trucks..they do look kinda like ambulances, but are far from it. I don't have to take a ride anywhere. I have worked for SCPD for many (oh say, 25) years and can assure you they are not ambulances. One of the old bomb trucks was a converted ambulance which was donated by Lakeland FD. There is ONE, JUST ONE, THAT'S ONE, ONE, ONE, I repeat ONE, AMBULANCE THAT IS OWNED BY SCPD. I have been assigned duty on it many times, and am aware of its function.
Those job postings are for county, town, village positions in the fire depts, parks depts, or any other entity that needs EMTs. SCPD is not hiring any EMTs, -that's a fact. You pay $15.00, enter your resume, and you go on a list. No test. In fact there is a "fire house atttendant" list also, which does have a test. Lots of titles, but none for the PD. If you are interested in a job somewhere as an EMT, its an easy way to get canvass letters notifying you of job availability around the county. Mr. EMS, please get your facts straight before you post misinformation on this board. Thanks..
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Toyota Soarer Specifications (http://www.toyota-wiki.com/wiki/Toyota_Soarer)

[BUFF]

I seriously doubt that SCPD is interested in EMS. Even on the slim chance that they might be, I don't think they would have a Nassau type system, just wouldn't work as well here. You want the easy answer, here it is. If you are getting out on all of your calls, then your current system is working fine. If your not, recruit (probably won't work) or pay providers. If you are using mutual aid more than once week, I think that is enough to warrant looking into a solution. Forget the response time ruling (which I agree with), it is about patient care. NOW YOU KNOW!!!!! So for all you depts or corps out there in denial, go to your Board or Chief's (whichever applies) and tell them it is time to fix the problem. SERVE THE COMMUNITY!!!! That is what we are all SUPPOSED to be doing anyway, right??????? I know this is a little harsh for all you wishy washy people out there, but that is it plain and simple. It doesn't matter about how big your district is, then put 2 crews or responders on either side of the district. Problem solved!!!!!! Everyone understands that you are going to have times when you get 2 or more hits, understandable, but lets get out on the first ones, we'll worry about second hits and so on later. Now I will admit that PD gets the calls 4-5 minutes before we do, that is FRES, not us. We need to get rid of this hand writing BS, takes too much time. It is not the dispatchers, its the system. We need to address this and then we can talk about true patient care. So lets park the pride and get the ambulances out. Regardless of who is paid or not. Funny thing is that almost all the paid guys in this county volunteer somewhere else. So it isn't that they are doing it for the pay check, its because they like it. Until then, lets be safe.........

[Vengeful Medic]

Right on the money....exactly what needs to be said...and all of it true.


Omar-Fara B. Norgaisse, EMT-P
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VAPORITE SOLO VAPORIZER REVIEW (http://vaporizer.org)

[BUFF]

Thank You Omar!!!!! I just wish everyone else would see it that way. It really is that simple. It does not have to be all that other crap about volunteers, pay checks, or money. There is not an ambulance company in Suffolk county that can not afford to do the above. It just means you can't buy 32,000 more t-shirts for all 12 members this year. Anyway, be safe and have fun out there.

[Vengeful Medic]

With all the tax monies that are levied in this county, there is no reason why we cannot get a decent (if not top of the line) custom designed CAD system in place out there. Hand Writing???? Didn't News 12 do a story on that in regards to Nassau County a couple of years back?? That is simply outrageous in this day and age of technology and with the issues we deal with today in terms of security and such, we should have an acceptable dispatch system (I'm not advocating the SPRINT system that is used in NYC that EMS created, as it is becoming outdated), but there are several CAD systems out there that can be custom designed for the needs of Suffolk County's Emergency Services (Police, Fire, AND EMS). We are already dealing with issues with interoperability and such. Technology and education should match up with those goals. Ok....I'm done with my rant...thank you...


Omar-Fara B. Norgaisse, EMT-P
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FERRARI P SPECIFICATIONS (http://www.ferrari-wiki.com/wiki/Ferrari_P)

[TOB FF]

The County received a $2,000,000 grant from the state for the CAD. Otherwise it was going to be scrapped from the County Budget. Hopefully the grant will get it completed.
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Medical Marijuana Card (http://mmjp.org)

[Vengeful Medic]

Then at this point it is a wait and see game.....

Omar-Fara B. Norgaisse, EMT-P
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Glass bubblers (http://bubblers.net/)

[SCPD]

i think for the most part us going on these calls are a waste of time. very rare is there a real 10-9 or 8. i'm sure its been mentioned the community views the fd as a shuttle to the hospital. most cases we just stand there,like shmuks,waiting for u guys to show up. we are very glad to see u, especially when it is a legit call.but then we spend another 5 minutes writing our little report, comp reports trouble... taken to...by....if we road on ambulances the o/t would go thru the roof. probably couild milk 1 hr, nearly every day. we also are understaffed, as u go out east, look at the new homes,coops,condos they are building and realize most pcts have'nt changed their staffing levels since 1970. if there was a way to weed out the taxi service calls, or assigned them a fee, maybe thru their medical ins. from the real that would be great, i dont think that should be a po's call, it should be someone more qualified like a paramedic. plus i know most pos would either call u out anyway, or after the 1st civilian complaint, our bosses would take that away.that is bad p.r.or even if they didnt change it, we would just call you out anyway. as far as not being busy, i'm an average cop, with 8 days left in this month, ive responded to over 130 calls written over 100 reports, over 20 summons, and 4 arrests, again i'm not anyone special, just a decent street cop. we earn our 100,000 salaries. my neighbor runs an auto detailing place makes like 90,000. he has never found a missing child, caught someone fleeing the scene of a murder,tackled a suspect, never even pulled a gun on someone. does he earn his money, yes.

[Ocrainaugh]

just to clear up a point, the suff co civil service lists for emt, cc and medic are the ones that we all hire from. it's for the fire dist's and ambulance corps, not the scpd.

after 30 years as a cop, I can tell you that there's noting more rewarding than going on the aideds. Yeah, battling crime is cool and fun, but getting down on the floor with the sick and injured is as good as it gets.
peace,
obewan

[Vengeful Medic]

It's amazing that people are still conjuring up that there's a conspiracy to turn SC into a paid system under their noses. Think about it people (and I know this is a bold statement): If SC was planning on putting on a fully paid system, do you really think that they would pussyfoot around everyone and keep saying, "oh, no..we're not going paid....everything is fine..."? No. They don't have to. One because if it was something that was going into play, it would simply be stated, griping and moaning be damned. Two, because there simply is no such plan. Stop this nonsense. Really. Some idiot somewhere might actually believe it. Thank you.

Omar-Fara B. Norgaisse, EMT-P
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Easy Vape Assembly (http://www.vaporshop.com)

[Conspiracy?]

Well, said, good sir, well said...

Omar-Fara B. Norgaisse, EMT-P

[suff medic]

First of all, it is inappropriate to assume that the "professional" police officers with the right training would do a better job than the "professional" emt / aemt / medics would do. I have been in ems for the past 14 yrs, both paid and volunteer and I can tell you first hand, that there have been only a few cops that I would let touch one of my patients. They are trained for police work. Yes, they do come out of the academy as EMT's, mostly against their will and they refuse to do anything on scene. An example...we come upon a male in cardiac arrest and when we walk in the door, what do you think we found...you guessed it...two cops staring at the patient. What do you think was their response when they saw the looks on our face..oh, we just got here. I guess that didn't think we could research to find out when they had arrived on seen..oh....about 7 minutes before us. They should have just cancelled the ambulance at that point...5-7 minutes brain DEAD! Let the people that have dedicated their lives to serving those people in medical need do their jobs.

[Vengeful Medic]

Don't you just love when even though they don't want to do @#%$, they have the unmitigated gall to try and tell you what to do on a scene??....Un-friggin-believable....

Omar-Fara B. Norgaisse, EMT-P
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Dc marijuana dispensary (http://dc.dispensaries.org/)

[Let me try to explain why]

I couldn't agree more about the gear issue... A carpenter has to have a hammer, as an EMT needs the proper tools to do his/her job. However, as the paid issue goes, call volume is not a justification for not providing timely ALS. Gordon Heights, who has been mentioned on here numerous times, is activated for approximately 150-200 of their own rescue calls per year (rough estimate), and this year will probably hit a record high of 450-500 because of 24's to other departments. Why is this important? Because having answered 150 or so calls per year for the last decade, the board of fire commissioners had the foresight to employ 3 full time ALS providers (1 per 8 hour shift) and 4 or 5 part timers to cover the weekend. 24-7 coverage in a district that answered 150 calls per year with an operating budget of under a million dollars (again, estimate). If a department like the Heights can afford to GUARANTEE that their tax payers will have an ALS ambulance every time that they need one, (as well as backing up their neighboring departments when they are tied up) there is no excuse for a district doing 1000 calls per year with a much larger budget not to. It's not a call volume issue, or how close to the hospital you are (a lot of other departments with a short destination time have paid). If one person who needed ALS or even just a really fast ride to the U (trauma) can't get it - JUST ONE - then you need to reconsider how you are doing things. Here's a better way of looking at it. What if that one person was you? Or your child? THAT is what matters.

[Medic]

The perfect example of a dept that has 2 hospitals in their first due district is Port Jeff VAC. They provide 0500-1700 mon-fri, ALS fly car and it is expanding to weekends. They have narcs and all. GHFD does a great job. I work for a neighboring dept and they are always willing to help. We used to go to them all the time and help them out, and now they are able to return the favor. We appreciate everything they do for us and they are just as appreciative when we help out also. I applaud the depts that put their pride aside and do what is right for their taxpayers. If you are getting out good with your volunteers, then I say great job. If your not, it is time to look at the facts. Taxes and real estate are at an all time high. Meaning that people are working 2-3 jobs to make ends meet. Call volumes are exponentially increasing in every district from Montauk to Babylon. They do not have the time to volunteer. Recruitment is tough these days and getting members to come out all the time is even tougher. Ask any Chief. I am a proponent of any means necessary. Whether it be Paid, Volunteer, or Combination. Whether it be Fire or EMS. EMS seems to be the more prevalent problem facing Suffolk, but I personally think that fire will eventually need help too. It is a matter of evolution. We are growing so large, so fast, it is going to be tough to keep up. They are building 3 retirement communities in my small district and it is probably going to kill us. Look at the call volume that Leisure Village produces for Ridge, they can barely keep up. It is tough out there. We are all doing the best we can, but sometimes we need more than that. Be Safe out there.......

[AnotherMedic]

That is good that PJVAC offers that kind of help and they are so close. Good for all the depts on the North Shore, they seem to be working together fairly well. There are some that need help and they know who they are, they are just afraid to admit it. People are dying and we are sticking by our guns. YOUR WRONG!!!! Get some help. There is nothing wrong with admitting you need help during the day or whenever. All that matters is patient care, not whether your members are going to like you for making the decision. Step up. You Chiefs and Commissioners are supposed to be leaders, so lead already. All these signal 3's and 24's are becoming nonsense and they ruin any chance of us ever getting any good patient care, therefore further ruining any chance of anyone ever treating us like professionals. No wonder why we can't get the county to give us decent protocols. I hope all who read this understand where I am coming from. This is not a Paid vs. Vollie thing. This is a life thing. People's lives are constantly being chanced because of foolish pride. To everyone who is busting their's, keep up the fine work.

[serf]

Some of the things you were saying are correct, but I know for a fact that SBFD does not do even close to 1000 calls. Last year, they did roughly mid 600's, averaging out to be 400 ambulance calls and 200 fire calls....
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Hemp (http://marijuanahemp.com)

[just a medic]

9 minute response time...lol.. thats a joke. i ride and work for 2 of the busiest departments on the island..and if i was sitting on the apron w/ the bus running and waiting i couldn;t make it across the district in nine minutes especially during rush hour,so whats the solution ... maybe we should take a look at what the city does and give up the plasma tv's,dvd-vcr-home entertainment centers,bars etc. and station buses out in district to even further cut response times down. but what do i know...its just my opinion that you don't need all those things to help save someones life which what all of us signed on to do in the first place before we found out about the fringe benefits of the job...

[Islander]

the multidistrict agency ems is a start , better than doing nothing

[Longtime FFEMT]

After reading all the posts on this thread I sincerely hope none of the ideas are actually carried out by ANYONE!

1. Taxpayers do not need to have SCPD Officers on ambulances - that is just plain dumb.
2. Setaukets first responders, Paramedics, etc. (Paid employees of that fire district), are not allowed outside that district. They work for a municipality - the fire district of setauket. As a setauket taxpayer - I wouldn't like that much.
3. Elaborate mutual aid ? Are you kidding, some departments cant get out for their own calls. Not to mention that traveling from one district to a neighboring district takes an extreme amount of time. All you have to do is look at our roadways at rush hour!
4. People complain about response time - again - ARE YOU KIDDING? In the early eighties when you drove down the road with a blue light flashing people moved out of the way and let you get to the firehouse. Now we have trouble getting people to move for the rig or the ambulance with all the lights going and sirens, air-horn etc. The public simply doesn't give a damn and that in itself is maddening for all the FF and EMT's trying to do a public service - FOR THEM !
5. When speaking about Nassau putting cops on ambulances - it hasn't improved anything. If you take the time to read the response times. The only stat that has improved is the response to call time, because they count their response by a police unit as their at scene time. The ambulance actually takes longer to get to scenes than before this systems implementation.
6. Some people say we should do what is being done down south - Paid volunteers. How it works - The call goes out - the first qualified people to the rig or ambulance take it to the call and are paid ten dollars for the call. Anyone who responds to firehouse and checks into their computer log within five minutes, but does not make the call gets five dollars. If you respond after five minutes you get credit for attending the call and that is all. What it has done is forced many to spend more time on a stand by crew at the firehouse. The money is TAX FREE - both State and Federal. It is called a reimbursement, they technically reimburse you for the wear and tear, gas, and maintenance of your vehicle and your time. Therefore it is tax exempt. Each year when you file your taxes, you file a report issued by the fire district or dept. showing the amounts earned and stating that this is a reimbursement of your expenses, time etc. These entities allow their members to be paid once monthly, (1st of the month), or to defer their payment for twice yearly payments on july 1st and dec. 1st. Sounds good to me, and it is sure to get everyone involved more quickly.

LETS TRY IT - I'LL SHOW UP ! (JUST LIKE ALWAYS!)

[serf]

Did everyone know that the SBUH Ambulance, which I believe get State Tax $'s, has signed onto the Holbrook plan and put an ambulnce and crew down there. How did that happen under everyones noses, when local areas close to Stony Brook could use the help.
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Glass bubblers (http://bubblers.net/)

[TWISTED II]

HOW MANY HAVE ASKED OR EVEN THOUGHT OF ASKING FOR ASSISTANCE??

[FIREMAN]

please if i have to see one more post with you crying about your call volume going up i am going to be sick everyones call volume goes up every year so please stop crying about it
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Decameron live (http://camslivesexy.com/cam/Decameron)

[Rsqrngr173]

ASK!!
SBUH EMS will respond to any call for assistance from any volunteer dept. as long as there is an ambulance available. ALS intercept, extra bus for an MVA, Stand-bys. The Multi Agency System (sorry, the offical name/acronym escapes me) simply asked SBUH if an ambulance could be provided to assist. Apparently, the answer was "yes".
Matt G.
NREMT-P

[SBFD SUX]

You have a 1.3 million dollar budget. Why don't you hire a 24/7 paramedic, and stop spending 40,000 for a Chiefs Tahoe with a million lights on it?

[jackass]

Because the SCPD should be earning their 105,000 a year FIGHTING CRIME!!! EMTS and Medics should ride ambulances, not cops!

[serf]

SBFF - I do know all too well about the situation at stony brook as I am one of the Marshals there. Your fire department is looking into ways yuor call volume can be reduced, the fact is for the last 30 years the campus has been here, it's been nice for you guys cause you only come for work. Now, Since county wont hold onto the calls, you guys get activated. So for all that time you guys came up here to play, you're now having to come up here for every alarm just like everywhere else in your district. The administration was briefly looking into whether the campus needed to look into a fire department here, They asked the local fire chiefs. Setauket said yes. Stony Brook said no. 30 I guess still wants to play when there's work but not come here for the BS. Now it's just like the old boy school. And just for some clarification, this mandate about notifying the fire departments did NOT come from our office as many of the members there think. It came from OFPC. Any questions, feel free to call me, the number should still be on the board in the radio rooms.

Twisted- SBVAC is what I'm assuming that you are talking about with state funding. SBVAC's funding does not come from the state, it comes from the college. Every student pays an activities fee for "clubs" on campus, and this is where they get their money. Their budget is SEVERELY less then any other ambulance company. From what I remember a few years ago, it was only about 77,000. Thats it. As far as them going to holbrook, I don't know about that, however, they have offered to take duty shifts at the local firehouses to alleviate call volume as well as give their agency some other experiance. Centereach was the only one that took them up on it for a while. I don't know if they are still doing it there. What's the big deal with them going to other places and simply doing a standby?

RsqRnger- Spaz, that you?


TTFN
904
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[Truckie]

Why would stony brook fd say no to a fire department on the campus if they can't handle the call volume. I am not from that area but it sure does sound like stony brook has there heads up there asses from what i have been reading.

[serf]

after re-reading your post, I think you meant the Hospital EMS. As far as that goes, I don't know much about that but it wouldn't suprise me with the 32 connection
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[conehead]

Like any of you guys like doing EMS runs...

[serf]

who were you addressing in that last post?
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[conehead]

Obviously, the problem lies within EMS alarms. There are too many, thanks to "assisted living communites" and they are killing the vollies. Suffolk County should have an entirely paid EMS service, and save the fire service before the entire thing implodes! Think about it...Without band-aid runs, how often would your pager be going off???

[123456789]

Conehead...

The problem is most certainly NOT with the assisted living communities. The problem is with failure to prepare or even adapt to them. What would your solution be? To ban construction of nursing homes in your district simply to keep call volumes steady. I hate to tell you, but we've only hit the tip of the iceberg when it comes to nursing homes, senior housing, etc...pretty soon it won't just be that one problem facility in your district, it will be eight.

[Twisted]

I think its great if they are available to respond to other departments and agencies. I know that Centereach was working on a plan with them for a period. I also heard that I think it was Coram who asked and they were denied, but not sure for what reason.
That whole Middle Country (Centereach, Selden Coram) corridor could use a breather due to the number of calls that come out of that area. Anyway if they are available I think everyone should request them, especially if it helps to get a rig somewhere sooner.
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[Nor inclination to read t]

from what I've heard is that third party billing isn't allowed at least in the brookhaven township area. I'll admit I've never looked that up on the books so I"m not sure if that is true or not.

[U may be right UFM]

volunteers. To call is illegal is a bit much.

[UFM904]

That's why I didn't call it illegal. I said it wasn't allowed. I remember hearing something about it being in the town code, but I couldn't fine it. It mught be in the State Town Law, I'm not really sure. I know in other states that 3rd party billing works great, but you can't just bill the nursing homes and assisted care facilities, it's all or nothing.
Yes insurance already will pay for it, but I can imagine the public out cry when someone tries this.
________
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[conehead]

I beg to differ... The assisted living communities are killing us. They rake in the $$$$ and we respond to "emergencies" which are really transports...They should be required to have a PAID ambulance, like LifeStar on their premises or within 10 minutes for their BS calls. I became a vollie to help MY community, not some rich guy who rips off the elderly under the guise of "ASSISTED LIVING"!

[TOB FF]

A few years ago third party billing for volunteer service was illegal and an attempt was made by the upstate departments to change it. The measure was opposed by the Suffolk Fire Service, I'm not sure of Nassau's position at the time. I don't know what the outcome was. My only concern is what happens to the insurance rates. Only those that have insurance get billed and only those that have insurance would have to pay the increased premiums that would have to result to support this, As usual, everyone would reap the benefits, including the taxi riders. No matter how you fund a paid service it would pretty much fall on the same people. Either way, increased cost of living. And those self serving studies swing to serve the other side of the spectrum also.
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[chiefnomore]

I posted this on the "LIFIREFIGHTER" website in Feb. 2003...
"The volunteer fire service in Nassau County should pull out of the EMS business. We are only fooling ourselves. Aside from a few die hard EMS personnel most fire departments view EMS as a burden.
The County should contract out the business to a private agency and take a cut of the profits. The private agency would remain a division of the Nassau County Police Department and would be required to maintain standards related to response times, patient care, etc. A review board could monitor the results on a quarterly basis. The independent agency would also have to bid on a contract every three years in order to retain their position as the sole provider of EMS in Nassau County. A County appointed board could oversee the operation and monitor the effectiveness.
The county could add a provision that requires this agency to hire personnel from a civil service list comprised of residents of Nassau County with preference being given to fire department personnel. A deal could be constructed to pool all of the resources available including EMS supplies and equipment, ambulances, etc. and the ambulances could be stationed at area firehouses. (Heaven knows we have enough of them). Dispatching could be a joint venture handled by the Nassau County Police and Firecom. While not on patrol, the ambulances remain housed in the firehouses rather than "patrolling" an area. This would cut down on wear and tear on the equipment and fatigue of the operators. These ambulances would be manned with two personnel: an EMT and an EMT-CC(or Paramedic). This way the Nassau County Police would not have to take two or more police officers out of service to drive the ambulances to the hospital. The last time I checked cops were supposed to be upholding!
the law and protecting our citizens; not driving ambulances.
Also, I would like to see laws enacted that require nursing homes/long term health care facilities/assisted living residences to be required to provide their own emergency ambulance 24/7/365 for the residents of their facilities. Anyone who knows about these facilities knows that they are the modern day gold mines. (Why else would they be popping up all over the place?)
A deal like this makes great fiscal sense to the County; especially since the County is strapped for cash. Since fire departments generally do not charge for their services, each year hundreds of thousands (possibly millions) of dollars are being lost. We all know that EMS is a money maker if it is managed correctly so, why doesn't the fire service get together with the County and do something about it?"

The above was obviously directed toward EMS in Nassau County but I think some of the content applies to Suffolk as well. As the previous poster stated, these assisted living/nursing homes are making tons of money so, it's is time to hold them accountable to the residents of their "communities" and force them to hire fulltime EMS for their facilities.

This will not alleviate all of the problems facing EMS agencies on Long Island today but it will certainly help.

That's just my opinion.



Be safe everyone.....................

[UFM904]

Jimmy aka jamespjack who posted on page 3.

TOB FF very true about the rise in insurnace. Never thought of it that way.
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[UFM904]

I posted that comment to huh on the wrong thread, sorry.
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[EMT for many years]

Yes these facilities are a burden to the volunteer EMS crews. They should have their own buses. One of the problems with this is that some of these facilities have a primary ambulance company on contract but if they call them (even for a 911 based transport) they can be given up to 2 hr. eta because they are on other jobs or if at night the crews that are on are on the other side of the county or in the next county over. I have had problems with going to a nursing home for a 911 based call to find out they did not want to wait for the private for 2 hrs. they want they pt.out. Sometimes we get there and because the crew on the private thought something might be up arrived at the same time and now we have a tug of war. I will normally give the call to them unless looking at the pt. that they need ALS and the crew is a BLS based one. This way I am keeping a 911 based ambulance in my district for my own community.

Another problem with the nursing homes is that they are calling us for a patient that they say is in severe resp. distress or just stopped breathing and they starting bagging. Only problem with these calls, The Patient Has Been DEAD for a couple of hours. These facilities have to realize with are not a body removal service but a real emergency vehicle.:"> :">

Any other hopes to improve how to handle these types of facilities. :">

[ltjag]

about the "legality" of billing for ambulance service. We have been doing it in Long Beach for about 11 years now. Why any department would not pursue billing for transports is a mystery to me. Maybe it's because Long Beach is not a district with its own taxing powers. I guess if you can just keep on jacking up peoples taxes for fire protection, then there's no need to pursue this stream of revenue. Bottom line is there is money out there to be had by FD's that do EMS transportation. Not going after it shows complete contempt for the poor taxpayer who is made to foot the full cost of all of these non-emergent "emergencies" that make up the majority of 911 calls. Not billing for your service is really quite shameful. It is a slap in the face to those who are forced to fund your department's operations.

[Good pt ltjag]

Hmmmmmm maybe if EMS services were receiving funds from billing, they wouldn't need to tax the public as much. Then again if you were paying for a service you no longer have that immunity from liability of being a volunteer since your company was being reimbursed and charging for it's services. Plus if you are getting billed for a service and the service is subpar as it is in most of the volunteer world you would have a great lawsuit if you are damaged ie. dead from the long response times and a guarantee of receiving the standard of care which is Paramedic level of care w/ in a reasonable amount of time. Nah, EMS providers will never go for it because it would bring an end to their substandard mutual admiration ego trip society.

[x]

About 5 years ago an amb co. in Brookhaven Town started billing. They gave a contract to a "medical billing company" owned by a member of the amb. co. without getting proposals from any other billing companies. This billing company also had an employee who was on the BOD of the amb co. A question was asked about the revenue collected. If (using hypothetical round numbers) the company budget was $200,000 per year and we collected $100,000 in revenue, would our tax funded budget go down to $100,000 there by saving the taxpayers $100,000 per year??? The chairman of the board said NO. We can do whatever we want with the money and we will still get $200,000 from the town. So the taxes will not go down. The membership of the company voted to stop third party billing because it was felt that we didn't "need the money" This was not some poor district with substandard equiptment. 2 non members of the company but district residents fought this through the town. AT THAT TIME Brookhaven town declared that billing could only be done if guidelines were established by the town, including rates. I guess that the town leaders felt that billing wasn't neccessary since the companies were tax funded. The town refused to set the rates and guidelines and therefore third party billing in Brooklhaven town was not allowed.
I am no longer a member of this company and do not not know for sure if things have changed with the town to allow billing but I have heard unsubstantiated rumors the this particular company started billing again without telling the rank and file of the membership.
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[suprised555]

Assisted Living Facilities allow residents to rent apartments and the resident enjoys benefits such as meals, housekeeping, social events, etc. While these items are provided to all in the facility the apartment in which the person lives is really a private residence. for this reason the resident calls 911 when the want and management can't control or triage those calls that might not need an ambulance. A nursing home on the other hand is responsible for all of the patient's care and the nursing home staff determine when to call 911. I have found that the majority of calls to nursing homes are for really sick people. Not as exciting as the car wreck but heart attacks, respiratory distress, etc. are common. It is far more likely that a patient picked up from the nursing home will be admitted to the hospital then the person picked up at their private home.
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[suprised555]

Billing for service may be logical but there are a couple of issues/concerns with this. It would be illegal not to bill everyone the same. This means we would have to bill the old lady in the house with chest pain in the same way we bill the person from the car wreck. Billing MUST be the same whether the patient has insurance or not.

The whole concept of taxing vs. billing is that taxing spreads the financial burden to all. Could we eliminate taxes for the police department and then charge if you called 911, had a robbery, broke down at the side of the road? Probably, but it is more logical to charge everyone a share of the whole rather then bill item by item. I may pay $200 per year now to my FD but if I called 911 I would probably get an ambulance bill of $500 - $1,000. The elderly in the community with fixed incomes who are major users of the EMS system would cry foul (they have to pay the deductible) immediately.
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[Medic247]

You do not have to bill the same with everyone. It all depends on what you do for your patient. If they g et an IV or drug therapy that would be more expensive than a long board and a c-collar. If you apply O2 it is charged. That is how it works. I used to work in a 3rd party billing type system. It all depends on what your patient needs and gets. That being said, then the insurance companies decide what they will pay. If the person just fell and twisted there ankle and you have members starting IV's and giving meds, then they won't pay you for those services. As they shouldn't it is not needed. The only places it doesn't work is when you have a large population of people on welfare. Medicare/Medicaid pays whatever they feel like and you get stuck with the rest. So if you charge $250 for a patient with chest pain, they will pay you $180, and you have no say in it. Thats it. I agree, taxation is much better because then you don't have to worry about where your source of income is coming from, its there every year. 3rd party billing allows you to make more money, or sometimes less. There is that chance. Most organizations that 3rd party bill, end up doing transports to keep up the cash flow. Also means that you would have to rely more heavily on donations. So it has its positives and negatives, but you could not charge an even amount for every call, every patient is different, therefore every amount is going to be different. Good Luck with this discussion and be safe.

[Jeffersons Ferry]

Can a volunteer department bill places like Jeffersons Ferry and Atria, who make money off their patients, and not bill the taxpaying residents of their community? That would be ideal. Even better would be if they had an ON SITE, paid ambulance....Maybe they could hire the EMT's from their local fire district, pay them 10 bucks an hour, and save the volunteer fire/ems service before it burns out of existence!

[Look vollie dopes]

as one poster put it. The well to do EMS agency didn't need to bill since they already had enough tax money. Allow me some poetic license in paraphrasing. Guess what folks the city of NY pays for its paid fire/ems services via taxes. They also look to get reimbursed for ems services via billing to supplement the cost of running a paid ems service and they charge user fees for fire inspections and permits. The city charges for these things via "user" fees to help defray the overall costs of these services not to completely pay for them. As a result of these user fees property taxes in the city are a fraction of what they are out in Nass/Suffolk, yet they receive a superior level of municipal services at a fraction of the cost. Newflash, if the fire/ems service in Suffolk county went paid tomorrow there would be thousands of City PD/Fire/EMS personnel lining up to take the job and even do it for less than they are being paid now. Why for less than they are being paid now? Shorter commute, better quality of life and no city income tax. The heartwrenching little old lady w/ chest pains scenario isn't holding water. Using your sad story I guess we can infer that there aren't ANY elderly people in NYC since they can't afford the cost of an ambulance ride. Somehow the residents of all of these other cities and towns including Long Beach are able to accept being billed for ambulance services without having to flee to FL. Medicare, medicaid, auto insurance policies and health insurance companies all provide for paid ambulance services. Charging for ambulance services as an adjunct to having a tax district is fiscally responsible and would lead to a reduction in the monies needed via that tax district. Lastly, if billing were done and all of a sudden there were a dearth of extra monies maybe the knife and fork whats in it for me vollies would start to realize they have the money for supplemental paid EMS services to guarantee a paid paramedic on every call and provide the residents of their communities the level of care they deserve and have paid for, not the hodge podge of hit or miss varying levels of care and atrocious response times that have been forced onto them via the current vollie system.

[Bill]

You sound like that dick from Long Beach.....Is that you Ltjag?
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[Sorry bill]

I'm just another realist who has been both a paid and volunteer fire/ems provider who has had enough of 110 little knife and fork club kingdoms that are continuiing to put the public in peril while at the same time wasting Billions of taxpayer dollars to stroke their little man egos w/ their penis replacement devices. AKA chiefs cars w/ gold leaf, unique one of a kind pieces of apparatus instead of generic purchased on city or state bids. The same knife and fork azzwipes who squander tax dollars renovating their own personal mutual azzkissing societies/aka taj majal facilities. Squandering tax dollars driving chiefs vehicles into NYC as nothing more than free commuter vehicles. Wasting taxpayer and donated monies travelling to Chiefs or Commissioners or EMS or Firefighters conventions not to mention the booze, meals and strippers that are bought while on those trips. Eliminate all of the above waste and all of a sudden we have enough money for a paid system w/ accountability and a standard of care. For all of the medics who cry themselves to sleep because they don't have paralytics or narcs in the volunteer system, guess what you probably never will until the system goes paid because of accountability and trust that is sorely lacking by the MDs of most, but not all of the volunteer providers. Am I Ltjag, not a chance I can't write as eloquently as him and I don't have the time to nor inclination to be polite about what I see as a wasteful, dangerous unprofessional system. Big tobacco, firearms industry, auto industry all have been litigated into compliance by the paid liers. The woefully inadequate vollie ems/fire system's day is coming the lawyers will eventually wake up and realize how deep the pockets are of these agencies and they are next. After a few million plus settlements the system will be uninsurable as a whole and all of the part time semi pro wannabes will have to go sit at home crying over their photo albums.

[volly dopes]

Why not write a letter to the editor of Newsday or New York times?

Which department set your opinion of the fire service?

Why not run for office / commissioner and improve the system?

[vanbytheriver]

Sorrybill,

You are right about the litigation in terms of EMS / Fire service liability. Most departments do not offer their volunteers any coverage. Every call they are risking their savings, home, and future earnings. Courts are piercing the "good sameritan act".

BTW, LTJAG is leading the way on litigation in the recent Federal Case he filed for Discrimination and Wrongful Terminiation, with the actual federal case submision against the city of long beach, the city officials, Gene, and officers and members of Long Beach, which was recently posted on this and other sites:

"BTW, I served the City, and all of those who conspired against me, with a federal lawsuit today. When I get done with them they'll all be living in a van, down by the river. I'll keep my fans posted on any developments."

[quess what]

When the suit is settled, the city of long beach will be renamed the city of ltjag.

paid is superior! volunteer is sub standard?

[Letter writer]

the view of the "heros". Ignorance is bliss and the media doesn't have an appreciation of nor do they know the differences between paid/volly. As for "Why not run for office / commissioner and improve the system?" You will not be elected commissioner w/o the backing of the vollies. The majority of the votes in Commissioner elections come from the vollies and their families. I would have a snowballs chance in hell of getting elected by the ignorant knife and fork whats in it for me set if I ran on a platform of change. Lastly I know Commissioners who truly want change, but they are out voted by the status quo Commissioners who like their little kingdoms just the way they are. Fast and loose and without too much oversight of their trips, cars, credit card purchases etc. Change will not come from within, it will be forced down from above. The Fire/EMS svc. can either do it on their own and be a part of it or they will ultimately be replaced by a paid svc. When the paid day comes the ignorant unwashed masses of volly morons have no one else to blame other than themselves. Watch how fast the Commissioners start hiring people to do the job after they are personally named as defendants in wrongful death and personal injury suits that run the risk of piercing the corporate veil and personally attaching against their homes, pensions, bank accounts. "Mr Commissioner isn't it a fact that the standard of care or service as per NFPA, NYS EMS etc. is X? Isn't it a fact that you were aware that your vollies weren't providing the standard of care or meeting X standards? Er, uh well they were just volunteers trying to do the best they could. Yes, but you were aware they weren't cutting the mustard and after all you are the elected official responsible for protecting the community through any means appropriate. You could have hired paid/FFs/EMS personnel and if you had my client would be alive today because response times to get a FF to the scene quicker would have been adhered to or A Paramedic on scene in less than the 20 minutes that it took your substandard of care EMT-CCs to get to the scene.

Tons of money to be made from the ignorance and Fups of the "heros" the day is a coming. The medical profession, police profession and others have been forced to "do the right thing" as a result of litigation and the fire/ems svc.s day is a coming.

[what]

you must be from sfd to be so specific on two of the three biggest offenders in the SFD district. As to why dont they hire emts from the dist is because according to insurance bulls*!t you are not allowed to be paid for the same title you vollie for in the same municipality. Talk to your legislators to amend this and proceed from there
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[UFM904]

Although your statement is correct that a member may not be apid for a position they also volunteer. You are incorrect in your statement that if jefferson ferry hired emts from the district that it would be illegal. Jefferson's Ferry can hire who they want, they are not a municiplaity. So jefferson's ferry, Sunrise Assisted Living and Atria could all hire emt's from the department. It's when they would be paid by Setauket Fire District that it would become a problem.
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Toyota GT-One picture (http://www.toyota-wiki.com/wiki/Toyota_GT-One)

[reread my post]

Alright, I thought you were responding to the question that someone posed about Jefferson Ferry hiring their own personnel. My Mistake. Homecoming should be good, they are having fireworks again. Should be a good time.

[FireFighter]

If you were facing an armed robber, would you want the po in your sector in an ambulance? Not me brother!

[why care]

I would like to know what law you are talking about lindenhurst just hired two from within porter/emt.I here the one has his head so far up the chief's butts, I guess its not what you know but who you blow

[EMT for many years]

I heard they only hired 1 emts no als. They even hired their own. This makes no sense. Do you ever listen to their calls on the scanner. They have to 24 a 16A no less but they could hire them to come out for money when they would not show up as a volly. The 1st day they were up and running one of there rigs were called for a 2nd 16, a 24 to Copiague. Whoever it was on the radio kept telling Central to call the chief because they had a "PAID EMT" on board. What is the difference. Dont they owe the other communities a helping hand since they have all been covering there BUTTS. What is the story over there.

[smokey]

usually the district won't allow the emt/medic to go on a 24. They are paying that person to serve their community not anyone elses, so the choice to get the chiefs permission was correct.

[serf]

Why would the taxpayers of one comminuty allow a person to get paid and handle emergencies that aren't in their area, that is not paying for that service. I agree that they should have called the chief. Can you imagine what would happen if it got around that such and shuch district was letting their paid people to go on 24's? They would constantly be called for 24's and then not be available for emergencies in thier own area.
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[LI Paramedic]

When are you all going to realize the change in times.I worked in alot of different programs in NY. Years ago I worked for a private ambulance service that provided ambulance service during the day time hours. Hiring EMT/EMT-CC/Paramedic's is just a bandaid for the issue at hand. All fire companies and ambulance companies need to research the long term fix and not the bandaid. You have to think of the residents of your town and not your pride. Day time hours are tough for every organization. Make the statement and start the trend. In New Jersey private hospitals provide ambulance and flycar service. I think the flycar service the same as North Shore provides in the Islips. I don't know how North Shore does it without being able to bill the patient. I think if our companies let North Shore and Stony Brook place a ambulance in our districts during 6am and 6 pm, our resident and press would have nothing to attack us about, but only praise us. Keep the private ambulance companies out.....

[LI medic]

Suffolk should close every volly ambulance in the county and contract it out to AMR or Rural/Metro. Then hold their tails to the fire if they don't meet specific response times and staffing levels. Work out a contract where the company gets fined for responses that don't meet the requirements. Suffolk county would be a cash cow and these corporations would be jumping over each other trying to get the contract.

Now I know someone will post an uninformed remark about how bad AMR is, but it's only because they are seen by these people as being the competition. Nothing the competition does is ever adequate in their eyes.

I would honestly take any EMT or medic that does their job full-time over a part-timer or less, a volunteer. The ONLY way to learn how to be a good EMT or medic is to do A LOT of jobs...not only that, but you have to practice on each of these jobs, even the BS ones. The best people to perfect your assessment on are healthy people. Unfortunately, I would argue it is next to impossible to run A LOT of jobs when you only show up for "duty night." I ran close to 800 calls my first year as a medic, more than some of the volly ambulances on the island did all year, and I'm definitely not perfect. How many calls does the average volunteer do per year? 100? 200? I don't think that's enough.

[dope]

lets do it!

[bowlin for dollars]

who cares...install a pool and impress me!

[FD]

It disappeared just like this one is going to do. Unfortunately this a bashing site not a positive site. people visit it just to read gossip. like im sure coram wants to hear are dirty laundry. or we need to hear theres. the fact is many of us are addicted to this site just want and have to know. you can bet there is a handful of people that have this site as there home page tell me if im wrong i bet not.
________
buy herbalaire (http://vaporizers.net/herbalaire-vaporizer)

[still here]

[Mikecp421]

bump

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UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!

















vollies suck











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UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!

















vollies suck




















UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!






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UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!









UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!
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UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!

















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UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!

















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vollies suck




















UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!






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UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!








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UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!













UNprofessionals SUCK MOOSE CCK!!!!!

















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[Lets go paid]

Lets go paid

[PRO FOR PAID]

Like many others I show great concern for a professional system, particular to EMS operations. Despite the potential of increases in taxes the services rendered would be second to none. Though I am not a paramedic I feel that they are the only ones to be hired, leaving me the EMT-CC and EMT-B's out. Just think of the potentials in health care. RSI, CPAP, pain management and other much needed medications can be given with no orders. And all of this can be achieved by having higher standards, and constant updates, and training. That of which a professional instituion should hold. As with the giving a service to a private entity such as AMR or Metro Care, get bent. They would charge more than civil service would , mainly due to they a profiting corporation.

[lbltjag.]

deleted cause you are a stupid vollie

:roll:

[ADD]

Do you really think anyone will read that? Short and simple is the rule of thumb- Thanks :D

[guest8]

:lol:

:oops:

It disappeared just like this one is going to do. Unfortunately this a bashing site not a positive site. people visit it just to read gossip. like im sure coram wants to hear are dirty laundry. or we need to hear theres. the fact is many of us are addicted to this site just want and have to know. you can bet there is a handful of people that have this site as there home page tell me if im wrong i bet not.
I'll confess, I'm one

anyone hiring??

[Unregistered6666]

666

[Unregistered EMTNOMORE]

I know that the Coram FD pays a CC and a P as a crew from Midnight to 0900 and 0900 to 1800. This allows for ALS coverage 18 hours a day, and still leaves 1800 to 2400 for the volunteers to cover. The fireman are very supportive of the paid crews. The other great thing is that during the day if they get a double hit, they can steal a houseman or vollies to split up and have 2 ALS crews. It seems to work really well, and they have been doing it for approx 2 years now without much problem. Originally they were abused by the surrounding departments, but now the commissioners have set guidelines and most of the surrounding districts finally went out and got their own ALS responders. For the most part they seem to get along with the other districts. The best part about this system, the public is covered and the FD stepped up to protect them. You know why????? Because they realized they could not do it with vollies anymore. Not saying this is for everyone, some don't need to go this far, but I will tell you I like it and I wish it was in my town. Be Safe out there......
ALMOST RIGHT IT's that way 24/7/365 Plus THEY BRING IN A THIRD CC/P DURING THE BUSY TIMES AND MOST OF ALL THE VOLLIES STOPPED RIDING AND THERE ARE NO GUIDLINES OR RULES

[Unregisteredfedup]

I'm sorry but I never reply to these things, but seeing how it's implied that West Babylon has their act together just makes me want to laugh at loud and make one observation.

Medics on the volly side at West Babylon? A couple of them are good when they are around, but apparently Ya never seen their only female medic (the one with a beard ) work. What the heck, nobody has! Last week, a kid gets hit by a car, obvious head injury (besides other injuries), and the asinine MEDIC was standing there holding a C-collar. When asked what she was waiting for, she said for the truck...WTF!! Sorry the kid was going most likely die anyway, but to see, hear the sector car ask if someone could do somthing..and her standing there doing absolutely nothing till the copter arrived was beyond just lazy but criminal. This is not the first time she totally ignored patient care, its been hidden by the department for years. One day she'll be brought up on charges, they will look at previous PCR's and see how useless she is. What’s up with the county using her as an instructor or Deer Park as a paid employee? There has to be some body who’s taken notice! What are the Chief, Commissioners doing, sleeping?

[someone who cares]

the members of wbfd have noticed and are aware of what she, the bearded one, is and is not doing. our hands are tied. she is loved by the higher ups and the rest of us have to put up with her. she covers herself well on the pcr by not writing enough to show she should have done more. she doesnt like most of the CC's that are there because when they come on scene they show her up by doing the best they can for the patient dispite her. She will get hers one day. oh and by the way, DPFD, their head man absolutely loves her. she can do no wrong as per her. why do you think they promoted her to the weekend supervisor.

[SWEETTT]

EMT's #1 can never do a medics job. How many EMT's do you see intubate a person when they are in arrest or failure? How many EMT's have you seen pace a 3rd degree h/b? NONE!! I rest my case.
I am a volunteer FF/Paramedic and I work f/t as a Paramedic. The fire service on LI is running fine. It is the EMS service that needs to be a PAID system. You need a health system like NSUH to come take it over or maybe SCPD run a similar style program like Nassau but have it paired up as EMT/Medic instead of having just a Medic in a bus all alone....Just my 2 Cents


BLS BEFORE ALS YOU OLD FART!!

[Unregisteredogplease]

BLS BEFORE ALS YOU OLD FART!!


Oh please, not that old cliche. That is what EMTs say to justify their existence. What helps patients is the practice of medicine which is what paramedics do. EMTs practice first aide, paramedics practice medicine. Get that straight and you will see why there is no need for EMTs.

[BLS4EVER]

Oh please, not that old cliche. That is what EMTs say to justify their existence. What helps patients is the practice of medicine which is what paramedics do. EMTs practice first aide, paramedics practice medicine. Get that straight and you will see why there is no need for EMTs.
Stop touching yourself a- hole!

[Unregisteredbackagain]

Stop touching yourself a- hole!


Great comeback. Instead of trying to have an educated arguement and prove it wrong, you show your true colors. You are just another example of why we need to increase the educational requirements for EMS. We can then weed out the uneducated, inept providers who do it for their egos and not the patients. Why do you think the Brady book is written at the 8th grade level? The only reason not to support higher education is a fear that you would not be able to meet the requirements. Have we hit a nerve? Is that why you are getting so defensive and insultive?